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Old 06-08-2012, 09:36 PM   #1
amadave
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Default No Apollo MFD in Modules

Hi. Total rookie here. I just downloaded Orbiter last night hoping to run the Apollo 7 sim. I have Project Apollo NASSP in my Scenarios list but I have no Project Apollo MFD in my Modules list from the launchpad and the scenario asks me to activate it at the start.

What did I do wrong?

Thanks

Dave
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Old 06-09-2012, 01:18 AM   #2
theshhh
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Hmm, ive never tried it so, idk.
but trust me (ive tried NASSP a bit) AMSO is WAY better. better graphics, sound and much more.
I never knew it had a autopilot tho, maybe its a new feature. (since i last tried it in 2011)
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Old 06-09-2012, 04:57 AM   #3
Will
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From what I can tell, AMSO is better for the visuals, sounds etc, NASSP is more realistic for the systems modelling, flicking switches etc
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Old 02-07-2013, 11:09 AM   #4
Airthumbs
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Default More MFD Apollo problems

I just read this post having done a search for Apollo MFD.

I have installed the latest versions, in the modules tab I see Apollo MFD, I activate it and then launch the scenario.

I get a message saying I need to activate the module.

I don't understand?

Has anyone found a solution to this problem yet as it is impossible to interact in this scenario without the extra MFD's.

It's quite frustrating as I am a relative newbie here. Sorry for dragging up an old post but I see no one has provided any solutions including the original poster?

Any help would be very much appreciated......
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Old 03-26-2016, 12:19 PM   #5
polaris149Tiberius
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I have been having a similar problem. I am at this point simply looking for the MFD that is listed here:
http://nassp.sourceforge.net/wiki/ProjectApolloMFD

If anyone can tell me how to get that MFD, I think I can get it to work. For testing reasons for a low end box, I have been tasked to test NASSP 6.4.0 Patched to 6.4.3 with (NEPNEP_050223) as the wiki site recommends. I have installed the addons to a fresh copy of Orbiter 2006 P1 w/SDK and there is no additional dlls in the \Modules\Plugin folder. I would expect to see some new file for the MFD there but no file. Can anyone please help with this completely lost MFD. I REALLY don't like to loose the ability to download or locate such a nice functional MFD as this.

P.S. Googling doesn't give much. My guess is that it either came with some component of NASSP (Project Apollo) at some point in the past, or is called something else entirely but listed at OrbitHangarMods or was only available from somewhere like Medville or even AVSIM.

Please help me I need to find this MFD, even someone's copy and better yet, the source or the author would be primo. Thanks in advanced to whomever can help.
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Old 03-26-2016, 05:29 PM   #6
mike-c
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this is a preliminary answer, back at my orbiter-station i can give more details.
Modules\Plugins\ProjectApolloMFD.dll was introduced with NASSP7, while 6.4 had some embedded checklist-display.

If i am permitted to give you advise: why not use 7 ?(ver. =< 200909xx on orbiter 2006p1 mark you)
This does run well even on a Intel-Atom Win8 tablet and has all the AGC progs needed for moonlanding (by lazyD).

Took me to the moon more than once.
To be completed later....
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Old 03-27-2016, 03:32 AM   #7
polaris149Tiberius
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mike-c Thank you so much. I just didn't think of that because the version I had in an Orbiter 2006 P1 only had 6.4 documentation so I just assumed since it had been so long, that NASSP 7.x was only for Orbiter 2010 P1 v.100830 . I am running this test on a Win XP machine.
I will install NASSP 7.x onto a clean install of Orbiter 2006 P1 v.060929 and report my findings.
THANK YOU SOO MUCH MIKE-C for your very awesome and speedy help!!! You are absolutely a life saver!!!
mike-c mike-c mike-c mike-c

Last edited by polaris149Tiberius; 03-27-2016 at 03:41 AM.
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Old 03-27-2016, 04:58 PM   #8
mike-c
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Default get to the moon with NASSP7 - NOW

De nada - this was nothing yet, i promised to give you facts:

NASSP7 exists for orbiter 2006 and 2010, you must use subversion of the according years,
else: crash (i tried).
https://sourceforge.net/projects/nas...us%20Releases/

The mentioned above ProjectApolloMFD.dll serves for three systems.
ProjectApollo and ProjectApolloChecklist, where the first is useful to change the crew inflight.
The other things AFAIK can be done in the cockpit.
According to the documentation that module also containes the ascend guidance for saturn. The developers seem not to be happy with it anymore; they do a lot of work at an embedded Saturn guidance-computer.
As of 2008 the LM was far less complete than CM/CSM but had the essentials (internal power, descend/ascend engine, gear deploy, RCS and LGC) to reach for the moon in quickstart mode. (See below...).
Between 2009 and 20010 something changed. The developers started a major sourcecode reformation, and the LM is not usable since.
One may think of three reasons:
  1. API-issues with orbiter 2010 (hit for example the ShuttleFleet addon)
  2. a major and yet incomplete rebuild of LM internal systems
  3. the (early) passing of LazyD was to heavy a loss for the project (what i believe)
Didn't find out more

So the developers decide, howto proceed and the orbinaut has to find his way.
After reading
i couldn't wait and set up orbiter 2006 side by side with 2010.
There is even orbiter2006 sdk
http://download.orbit.m6.net/mirror.html (from Huntsville, AL )
and OrbiterSound3.5
http://orbiter.dansteph.com/forum/in...?page=download (last entry)
still available.

Did Apollo 14,11,12 in quickstart mode (success) and Apollo15 (failure, crash into the moon) during last winter. (the details will fit better in another thread)
Learned a few things about NASSP , all the more i do not yet understand.
(Reason: beginner in vessel making. working on such things as ESA-IXV, SoyuzTMA cockpit and internal systems, NASSP as a programmer is to big for me).

P.S. bidding pardon for bad english due a lack of every days practice.
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Old 03-28-2016, 02:18 PM   #9
indy91
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I'm not sure what the goal here is. Creating the most functional NASSP version that will work with Orbiter 2006? What's the advantage of using Orbiter 2006? Since development on Version 7.0 started, not much work has been done on the Quickstart mode. It's all about getting the Virtual AGC scenarios to work. So Quickstart (or Easy) Mode might be horribly broken in the most recent versions.

In the old versions, you had to download an extra Module Pack, which included the dlls and the Project Apollo MFD. NASSP has basically migrated to Github now, but the most recent beta releases are also available through Sourceforge. These releases do not require any additional module downloads, or a CVS client, or Visual Studio. The relases package has it all.

Quote:
According to the documentation that module also containes the ascend guidance for saturn. The developers seem not to be happy with it anymore; they do a lot of work at an embedded Saturn guidance-computer.
As of 2008 the LM was far less complete than CM/CSM but had the essentials (internal power, descend/ascend engine, gear deploy, RCS and LGC) to reach for the moon in quickstart mode. (See below...).
Between 2009 and 20010 something changed. The developers started a major sourcecode reformation, and the LM is not usable since.
The last partly unfinished major feature for a 7.0 release is a simulated Launch Vehicle Digital Computer (LVDC++) for the Saturns. The old autopilot is actually not efficient/flexible enough to insert the Saturn V with realistic engine performance and masses into a translunar trajectory. So this feature is kind of needed for the current depth of simulation that we want from NASSP.

The 7.0 release will be for Apollo 7 and 8 (there are working scenarios for Apollo 9-11 and 15), and while some work has been done on the LM since the last proper release (6.4.3 or whatever it is), it's currently in a partly broken state. You can go through most of the LM Activation Checklist, but not the point that it is able to perform maneuvers. It also isn't very compatible with the DX9 client. However, you can fly missions that include the LM all the way into lunar orbit.
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Old 03-28-2016, 03:39 PM   #10
mike-c
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indy91 View Post
 I'm not sure what the goal here is. Creating the most functional NASSP version that will work with Orbiter 2006? What's the advantage of using Orbiter 2006? Since development on Version 7.0 started, not much work has been done on the Quickstart mode. It's all about getting the Virtual AGC scenarios to work. So Quickstart (or Easy) Mode might be horribly broken in the most recent versions.
I agree. NASSP is going to be a great one.
Testing every beta for orbiter 2010 i look forward to the very version wich can land the moon; (Apollo 7 and 8 flown in late 2015summer with 2010xx).

The actual goal here was to answer the question of polaris49Tiberius as good as posssible. What his goal is i do not yet understand.

Just to get over the time, installing 2008's ver on orbiter 2006 was worth trying (see tschachim' s tutorial). At least one can learn some basics for later startover (learn about the history of orbiter also) and fixing broken scenarios can't do harm to knowledge. Can tell you i had some good flights.

Since this is drifting off topic i will close now.
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Old 03-28-2016, 05:24 PM   #11
polaris149Tiberius
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indy91 View Post
 What's the advantage of using Orbiter 2006?
The advantage is that Orbiter 2006 doesn't use an installer to install it to the registry, AND that makes it portable, AND it works with older versions of Windows as well as the newer versions, AND most importantly it works with NASSP 6.4.3.

I don't think I have to emphasize the clear advantages of keeping older hardware and operating systems, and software around. For the very reason mike-c sites, developers make stuff that works in some areas maybe not in others but occasionally they break very cool stuff when fixing something else or by making it compatible with a newer platform, and the later versions don't do what they did in older versions(i.e. NASSP7 losing the LM functionality in Orbiter 2010 as sited by mike-c).

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike-c View Post
 As of 2008 the LM was far less complete than CM/CSM but had the essentials (internal power, descend/ascend engine, gear deploy, RCS and LGC) to reach for the moon in quickstart mode. (See below...).
Also, since the NASSP dev team isn't getting paid to make this AWESOME add-on, they don't really have much time to fix things in a timely manner. I prefer to work in some cases with an older version that works while Im waiting for the new version to get done as well as play and test the new NASSP 7 version. I have about 5 Orbiter installs I play with and test for various reasons. Some are personal. Some are not.

Hence keeping a good working copy of previous Operating Systems, Software Platforms, and modifications is something people have been known to do and in my case, I have reasons for keeping older versions due to some links constantly breaking and older versions of both Orbiter, NASSP and some MFDs and tools not being around anymore.

For instance. I would love to get the 8-ball to work in alignplaneii MFD. For a while, there was alignplaneii and AlignPlaneIIv1.2 (
Align Plane II V1.2
) listed on the Orbit Hangar Mods site. But only the alignplaneii's gimbal worked in Orbiter 2006 for my system at least. Now, alignplaneii cannot be found anywhere on the net. I however have a copy and a backup of alignplaneii if anyone ever wants it, I am all to happy to provide.

Good developers and some interested users keep old versions of things esp when developing is underway(example: GitHub), and with links and software disappearing, I prefer to be on the safe side of that equation.

Also, I wouldn't be too quick to criticize the continued use of Orbiter 2006. It has many qualities that Orbiter 2010 doesn't have.

To: mike-c, Thank you with a capitol "T" for your help. Your information was extremely helpfull for what I am attempting. Thank you for answering my question. I will report back any bugs I find with installing NASSP 7 on Orbiter 2006 P1.

Cheers

To

Last edited by polaris149Tiberius; 03-28-2016 at 06:30 PM.
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Old 03-28-2016, 05:55 PM   #12
indy91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polaris149Tiberius View Post
 Also, I wouldn't be too quick to criticize the continued use of Orbiter 2006. It has many qualities that Orbiter 2010 have.
Oh, I didn't mean to criticize, I was generally curious why to go through this trouble when there are newer version. The fact is that there is no version of NASSP, which is a simulation of the program that put man on the moon, that actually can put anything on the moon in Orbiter 2010. So that alone makes Orbiter 2006 a valid use for NASSP. Although today I personally would rather use AMSO to land on the moon than going back to the days without DX9 client, it's just so much nicer.
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Old 03-28-2016, 06:34 PM   #13
mike-c
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Default Apollo experience

No offence to AMSO (have done all but 13), but what is apollo without AGC, FDAI, IMU; GDC and all that stuff?

<REALISM 0> was indeed something like mode-b, but better than nothing.
Can't wait for next vacation to do this one:
http://nassp.sourceforge.net/wiki/IM...Virtual_AGC%29


Last edited by mike-c; 03-28-2016 at 06:36 PM. Reason: syntax
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Old 03-28-2016, 06:38 PM   #14
polaris149Tiberius
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indy91 View Post
 Oh, I didn't mean to criticize, I was generally curious why to go through this trouble when there are newer version. The fact is that there is no version of NASSP, which is a simulation of the program that put man on the moon, that actually can put anything on the moon in Orbiter 2010. So that alone makes Orbiter 2006 a valid use for NASSP.
The reason is because those older versions of NASSP are disappearing. So are some valuable MFDs and working modules. I have about 3 terabytes of storage so I am trying to keep kind of a repository of Orbiter stuff. I am also testing NASSP on various systems, and NASSPs functionality. I am also testing older NASSP versions on older OS's and older Orbiter versions. And yes that alone makes Orbiter 2006 valuable as well as the portability of it. To me that is something I need so its important to me for Orbiter 2006 to be portable.


Quote:
Originally Posted by indy91 View Post
 Although today I personally would rather use AMSO to land on the moon than going back to the days without DX9 client, it's just so much nicer.
Yes but AMSO doesn't provide the VAGC. I flown the heck out of AMSO, I do still love AMSO, but I am endeavoring to understand the coding behind the AGC and have fun while I test its functionality.

Last edited by polaris149Tiberius; 03-28-2016 at 06:48 PM.
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Old 03-28-2016, 07:28 PM   #15
indy91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polaris149Tiberius View Post
 The reason is because those older versions of NASSP are disappearing.
Are they? At least back until 2007 the releases are still on Sourceforge. But I'm sure that is where you found what you are currently using. According to this, version 20100104 was the last version created specifically for Orbiter 2006.

Quote:
Yes but AMSO doesn't provide the VAGC. I flown the heck out of AMSO, I do still love AMSO, but I am endeavoring to understand the coding behind the AGC and have fun while I test its functionality.
Which is precisely why I enjoy working on NASSP. It doesn't get better than the real AGC software!

If you have trouble with the CSM Virtual AGC then consider using the Pad Load from the most recent Beta version. The Pad Load is all those "CMPAD" numbers in a launch scenario. A lot of progress has been made on these numbers since 2009 and they are not dependent on the Orbiter version. Some of these numbers may depend on the properties of the CSM spacecraft back then though.
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