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Old 05-10-2014, 03:08 PM   #31
Castor
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Originally Posted by Urwumpe View Post
 Remember to only plan for about 60% of the time to be useful, with the remaining 40% simply being buffer.
Thanks, I will keep that in mind. Just how much time do you feel would be just right for a station of this scale?
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Old 05-10-2014, 03:40 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Castor View Post
 Thanks, I will keep that in mind. Just how much time do you feel would be just right for a station of this scale?
Can't tell - at least not without being wrong by a factor of four in any direction in the end.

Sure not 10 years of simulation time. But also sure not one year, unless you launch daily and have multiple vessels in orbit at the same time.

I would start by planning the station first, by analyzing the dependencies. Which services does every module offer to the station and which module needs the services of which module to function. Then I would decide, in which order I can launch the module, if I would need additional temporary modules or spacecraft to keep the station intact. Since the XR-5 can easily launch multiple modules, I would group modules together as good as possible, but never try to fill the payload bay with modules, if this could result in some modules being just dead weight. The station also needs to stay controlled, after you undocked.

Don't expect that every assembly step happens in zero time. Even on a good day, moving a module to the right spot of the station with a RMS can take 30 minutes. Launch, orbit, docking, deorbit, etc as well. Try to use best estimates there and look how soon the next mission could get prepared. Better have more time for some task than really necessary: Haste makes waste. Better let the vehicle orbit a day more, if a hurried deorbit could result in a crashed XR.

And finally: Remember that you can't instantly launch again after landing. The next launch window will likely open at least 11 hours later.
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Old 05-10-2014, 03:47 PM   #33
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 Thanks for bringing me back down to earth! You are right, a very realistic approach might take about 20-25 missions to get something substantial up in orbit. So, we have no choice but to use the XR5 for major parts of the station building.
I don't want to sound like advertiser but HCLV-4 can lift ~120 tons to LEO. 4 launches of HCLV = 1 launch of XR5

Last edited by Loru; 05-10-2014 at 03:51 PM.
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Old 05-10-2014, 04:01 PM   #34
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 I don't want to sound like advertiser but HCLV-4 can lift ~120 tons to LEO. 4 launches of HCLV = 1 launch of XR5
You are right but then parts like radiators and docking ports can't just be launched aboard a rocket. It would also require the deployment of a tug of some sort (maybe, the Tranzit) to get it to the station.
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Old 05-10-2014, 04:16 PM   #35
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 You are right but then parts like radiators and docking ports can't just be launched aboard a rocket. It would also require the deployment of a tug of some sort (maybe, the Tranzit) to get it to the station.
Why not?

All you need is tug to haul it to space station and some form of RMS equpped shuttle with few UMMUs to attach it to the station. If your payload is large, you can use HCLV-4 Inline adapter with Kulch's Buran-T container (plenty of room inside). Or even 2 of them attached to each side of the rocket.

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Old 05-11-2014, 03:40 AM   #36
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What's IMS?
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Old 05-11-2014, 08:11 AM   #37
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 What's IMS?
With Interplanetary Modular Spacecraft(IMS), you can try for the planets in a ship of your own design, or build what strikes your fancy. You can put together space stations with the stuff provided, and I brewed up a few designs for LEO space tugs for my own purposes awhile back. Neat stuff.
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Old 05-11-2014, 12:29 PM   #38
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One of the things I enjoyed the most from the original OFSS was flying some vehicles I'd never used before, with realistic dV's that really test you if you are used to DG or XR level performance. Just something to bear in mind for the technical challenge of doing the construction.

The other thing is flying the missions. I would give a fixed time slot (e.g. 7, 10, 14 days) per section, and encourage the whole team to fly them (for the whole experience and to try out these different vehicles). For each section, we nominate a lead mission and a reserve mission, and then we have maybe 10 others also flying the mission in that time slot.

Ask everyone to post their completed scenario post-section. When the time slot expires, we take the primary team's completed scenario if posted, else the reserve, else the first one posted from any of the "alt" team.

This gives a much higher likelihood that it will be built in a fixed schedule, and keep the interest level up.
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Old 05-11-2014, 01:21 PM   #39
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 One of the things I enjoyed the most from the original OFSS was flying some vehicles I'd never used before, with realistic dV's that really test you if you are used to DG or XR level performance.
I tried out the tug mission Loru proposed earlier. It was challenging enough with the Tranzit tug. The CTV could also provide a realistic theme to the missions.

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Originally Posted by ADSWNJ View Post
 For each section, we nominate a lead mission and a reserve mission, and then we have maybe 10 others also flying the mission in that time slot.
That's quite a good idea, though it depends on how many volunteer to fly the mission.

Another doubt that just popped up in my mind (please forgive me if it's a stupid one) :

Should the missions be a single try sort of thing ? What I mean is that the if the pilot botches something up in the mission, he can either try and fix it or make an abort landing. In the latter case, future missions would attempt to resolve the problem.
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Old 05-11-2014, 02:06 PM   #40
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I was actually thinking of some way to integrate the Soyuz docking adapter from here into the station. I guess there is no way to do that, unless I convert it into a custom module.
That should be possible without problems, you just have to write up an IMS config for it (use the already existing docking adapters in IMS as a start, all you have to change are the port positions, add an attachment point, and change the mesh).

IMS will then use the Mesh with the values you provided, bypassing SC3 (then again, I don't see why that module would use SC3 in the first place. t doesn't seem to have animations).
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Old 05-11-2014, 02:31 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by jedidia View Post
 That should be possible without problems, you just have to write up an IMS config for it (use the already existing docking adapters in IMS as a start, all you have to change are the port positions, add an attachment point, and change the mesh).
I tried out your method, and the vessel spawns all right. But when I integrate the station, the docking port is just left out.
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Old 05-11-2014, 02:42 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by Castor View Post
 I tried out your method, and the vessel spawns all right. But when I integrate the station, the docking port is just left out.

Then you simply forgot the PreserveDocks = i,j (indices of dockports to preserve) parameter. There's a reason why I said to look at the configs of already existing adapter modules

Also, here's what exist in the terms of the config docummentation. It's not quite finished, and outdated here or there, but currently that's all there currently is.
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Old 05-11-2014, 02:46 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by jedidia View Post
 Then you simply forgot the PreserveDocks = i,j (indices of dockports to preserve) parameter. There's a reason why I said to look at the configs of already existing adapter modules
Sorry, I should have put it in clearer terms, I meant that the module does not get integrated into the station at all. And yes, I have the PreserveDocks statement.
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Old 05-11-2014, 02:51 PM   #44
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I meant that the module does not get integrated into the station at all.
Does it have an attachment point with proper ID?

You know what, just post the config here, this should be a really short fix.
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Old 05-11-2014, 03:03 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by jedidia View Post
 You know what, just post the config here, this should be a really short fix.
Code:
MeshName =DockingAdapterCBMtoSoyuz
Mass = 300
Size = 1.9
Inertia = 0.2 0.2 0.2

; === Docking ports ===
BEGIN_DOCKLIST
 0 0 -0.80   0  0 -1    0  1  0
 0 0 0.50    0  0 1    0  1  0
END_DOCKLIST

BEGIN_ATTACHMENT
P  0 0 -0.95    0  0 -1    0  1  0 IM
P 0 0 0 	0 0 1	1 0 0  XRCARGO
END_ATTACHMENT


ModuleType = Truss
PreserveDocks = 1


XRPayloadEnabled = true;
Description = IMS DG Docking Adapter
Dimensions = 2 2 2 
AttachmentPointIndex = 1
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