News Battle of Dogger Bank II?

Urwumpe

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Hard to believe that they made it through the broad fourteens with their carrier. :eek:h:
 

Longjap

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Looking at the amount of carbon coming out of the flagship, we are going to have to rename the White Cliffs of Dover.

http://news.sky.com/story/russian-w...-dover-strait-shadowed-by-royal-navy-10625732

N.

Those beautiful SU-33's. Gotta love them. :blink:

---------- Post added at 01:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:09 PM ----------

"Russia has the right to operate in international waters. There are plans in place for NATO navies to monitor the Russian ships as they head for the Mediterranean."

I wouldn't call the dover strait international waters. Are there agreements with Russians for Navy pass through?
 
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Notebook

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Its 20 odd miles across the channel at its narrowest, I think. Isn't there a 3 mile limit for national territory?

N.
 

Evil_Onyx

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12 NM limit, but so long as the ships stick to the shipping lanes they are allowed free transit. Same goes for the Strait of Gibraltar, and Singapore Strait.
 

Urwumpe

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I wouldn't call the dover straight international waters. Are there agreements with Russians for Navy pass through?

Yes, the right of passage. :lol: The same law that the US Navy enforces in the Black Sea from time to time. With Russia reacting a bit iffed by it.

http://www.seerecht.org/wegelein/iptext.htm

Another way of effectively negating the right of innocent passage to warships was advanced by the USSR in the 80s 5. The USSR designated certain sea-lanes within its territorial waters - which it is allowed to do according to Art. 22 - and declared, any passage other than through these sea-lanes would be considered non-innocent. No sea-lanes were designated in the Black Sea, which basically excluded the territorial sea from all innocent passage. In principle, the USSR declared every passage outside the designated sea lanes as non-authorized.
 

birdmanmike

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Tut mir leid, sorry, to be strictly correct, it is a designated international waterway, not right of passage. not the same as Strait of Hormuz. 24 hour strictly regulated jointly by both Brits and French, radar controlled. the narrowest part is Dover Strait c. 20 miles across. Going north use French side , south use English, so it's right side of the road ;-( over 500 ships a day sometimes, so it's not surprising - mostly international shipping of course, not warships. Also that narrow point used by cross-channel swimmers. Nato specifically said its international waters also, in reference to these Russian ships . . .
also Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_Channel for more and history also https://www.britannica.com/place/Strait-of-Dover and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strait_of_Dover
 
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A differentiation between the categories appears not to be necessary as the question of a permission of innocent passage is a matter of principle at this point: if certain ships can be required to give prior notice the right of innocent passage as such is qualified. If states do so, they generally claim that the right to require notification or authorization is inherently coupled with the right of innocent passage.

Is it my limited English or is this just badly written? I don't understand a flying weasel.
Are they required to notify the state for a passage or not?

If so, I would love to hear the Russian captain asking for permission.
"Ahoy UK, we're innocent. Moving along."
 

Urwumpe

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Is it my limited English or is this just badly written? I don't understand a flying weasel.
Are they required to notify the state for a passage or not?

Exactly that. Its both. :lol: Customary law.
 

birdmanmike

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The British do not own the strait, neither do the French. Which state would you notify? Neither appear to have been notified in any case, as the Russian route is estimated by observation. But if they don't keep to the shipping lanes and speeds, they could technically be intercepted and by either side. I'd like to see that. They certainly didn't ask for permission . . .
 

Longjap

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The British do not own the strait, neither do the French. Which state would you notify? Neither appear to have been notified in any case, as the Russian route is estimated by observation.
Thanks for clearing that up.
But if they don't keep to the shipping lanes and speeds, they could technically be intercepted and by either side. I'd like to see that.
Meh.. I'd rather simulate it.
 

Ravenous

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But if they don't keep to the shipping lanes and speeds, they could technically be intercepted and by either side. I'd like to see that. They certainly didn't ask for permission . . .

Heh and when they have a few loaded jets parked on the deck, they don't need to ask for permission :)

You've probably heard the old joke - where does a 500 pound gorilla sit... wherever he wants to :)
 

Urwumpe

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Heh and when they have a few loaded jets parked on the deck, they don't need to ask for permission :)

I would not be too sure there. They are in range of artillery, no carrier was ever so close to disaster. :lol:

But I doubt we want to shoot on the Kirov class battle-cruiser in our waters. :lol:

You know the old joke:

Americans: Please divert your course 15 degrees to the North to avoid a Collision.
Canadians: Recommend you divert YOUR course 15 degrees to the South to avoid a collision.
Americans: This is the Captain of a US Navy ship. I say again, divert YOUR course.
Canadians: No. I say again, you divert YOUR course.
Americans: This is the aircraft carrier USS Lincoln, the second largest ship in the United States' Atlantic fleet. We are accompanied by three destroyers, three cruisers and numerous support vessels. I demand that YOU change your course 15 degrees north, that's one five degrees north, or countermeasures will be undertaken to ensure the safety of this ship.
Canadians: This is a lighthouse. Your call.
 
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Urwumpe

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Yes I love the old tale of the Battleship versus the Lighthouse - though in the version I heard I think it was the Enterprise :)

I am sure, the tale will even be told when its about spacecraft and space stations.

"Raise your periapsis by 15 NM..."
 

Andy44

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"Mars: I'm a planet. Your call."

Last transmission received by the Exo Mars lander...

Sorry, couldn't resist.

One thing about nuclear-powered vessels like the Kirov and others I always wondered about: if you did actually sink one you wind up with a nuclear reactor on the sea bed, so maybe it's a good idea not to do it so close to your own home...
 

mojoey

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Or, tell the Tourism Ministry to draw up new brochures for the brand new hotsprings in the English Channel.
 
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