News Blue Origin Cancels Landing Technology Patent

[Thunder Chicken]

http://spacenews.com/patent-decision-may-not-spell-end-of-blue-origin-spacex-dispute/

Seems like BO's concept of landing a stage tail-first on an autonomous barge has some minor prior-art issues (SpaceX maybe? :lol.

From BO's patent application:

So does BO now have to license this technology through SpaceX?

 

[Urwumpe]

So does BO now have to license this technology through SpaceX?

No, but the patent has to be more specific - SpaceX claimed prior art in scientific papers and literature before 2014.

 

[GLS]

Well, it's not really SpaceX's idea.... :shifty:

FYI @SpaceX ripped off a Soviet era SciFI flick. Fast forward to 1:06:05 to see a rocket land on a Дрон Корабль https://t.co/efSskbaSoh
— NASA Watch (@NASAWatch) April 11, 2016

 

[Col_Klonk]

It's impossible to patent such concepts, never mind legally 'policing' it...
It's the same as patenting an aircraft landing on an aircraft carrier .. totally stupid idea - the patent that is :facepalm:

 

[Kyle]

Yea, this patent was nothing but a petty move to stifle competition.

 

[Urwumpe]

It's impossible to patent such concepts, never mind legally 'policing' it...
It's the same as patenting an aircraft landing on an aircraft carrier .. totally stupid idea - the patent that is :facepalm:

Not really - if you can provide a hardware implementation, you can patent it. Think of a docking port - which you can easily patent. Or a docking guidance system, which you can also patent as implementation.

 

[Donamy]

I've applied for a patent on chewing food, so everyone else has to swallow it whole.

 

[Urwumpe]

I've applied for a patent on chewing food, so everyone else has to swallow it whole.

Soup is the answer!

 

[Donamy]

As long as it's not chunky soup.

 

[Frilock]

I've applied for a patent on chewing food, so everyone else has to swallow it whole.

 

[Thunder Chicken]

I've applied for a patent on chewing food, so everyone else has to swallow it whole.

Works for Lent apparently. Nutrition FTW!

 

[Andy44]

I really don't see how you can patent something so simple and obvious. There have been similar attempts to land tail-sitting aircraft aboard ships before, and besides, this is a maneuver, not a new device or a manufacturing technique. I can see trying to patent the guidance system hardware or software, but the actual landing maneuver?

This reminds me of the Wright brothers and their foolish chasing of patents in court battles over the airplane, where they languished in legal battles while Curtis and other competitors left them in the dust.

If the Wright Bros. could've patented the technique of landing an airplane on a runway, they would've.

 

[N_Molson]

I just registered a new patent. It's an innovative, audacious while reliable mean of transportation called "Walking(TM)*". Everyone has to pay a lifetime fee of 0.01c to use it. That's a bargain ! And even though, I'll soon be rich !

:hmm:

* I'll reject any responsability for undesirable effects such as slipping on a banana skin, getting ran over by a bus, or shoes getting damaged by repeateadly hitting the Earth.

 

[n72.75]

This forum requires family friendly, SFW language, so I can't say what I'd like to say about patents.


http://www.x-plane.com/?article=patent-lawsuits

 

[Andy44]

I just registered a new patent. It's an innovative, audacious while reliable mean of transportation called "Walking(TM)*". Everyone has to pay a lifetime fee of 0.01c to use it. That's a bargain ! And even though, I'll soon be rich !

:hmm:

* I'll reject any responsability for undesirable effects such as slipping on a banana skin, getting ran over by a bus, or shoes getting damaged by repeateadly hitting the Earth.

I'll get around it by running!

---------- Post added at 11:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:23 PM ----------

Over in my OF blog there is an old discussion I had with some of you about IP rights a few years ago in case anyone's interested in dredging it up again. It's still relevant but mostly deals with the effects of the digital revolution on old ideas of IP.

 

[Ravenous]

Just a comment which I think explains these patents.

In the US you can patent a process that is blatantly obvious and already exists. You don't do this to make money from it (you would fail in court). You do it to prevent someone else writing their own patent later on and using patent trolling techniques to try and extract money from you.

Remember the big deal a few years ago when Amazon patented the technique of photographing items against an all-white background? Same thing. They didn't want some smart alec later on trying to extortion tactics.

 

[Col_Klonk]

Patents are expensive, and it's a long drawn out process to get one.
It's a minefield and if someone changes one 'technicality' of your patent.. you have no case.
Also chasing patents worldwide... well if you want grey hairs before you're 30.. fine.

Say BO patented the barge thing.. then Space-X would just launch from out of the USA.. and land in international waters.... this is going to be fun.

I came up with a ingenious idea (so I thought).. did a patent search only to find about 20 patents on the same concept (BO's story is a concept).. I didn't pursue the idea, and still hold it close to my chest (I should talk to Richard Branson sometime :rofl.

After closer scrutiny of the whole patenting system, I came to the conclusion that is was not worth it. If you have a product.. produce/sell it en masse for 5 years or so, then move onto the next idea. China will catch it and bring a cheaper version onto the market... so make your money while you can. If you can outdo the Chinese competition (they're not good at reproducing everything).. good for you.

Here's local a story ..
Plessey SA were developing the Tellurometer (microwave version I think it was) for the surveying industry. They patented it worlwide (big $$$) before is was actually ready. A problem developed that they could not get the required accuracy.. so the CEO and accountants shelved the project, against the advice of the developers.

The developers (a doctor and professor in microwave technologies - with whom I worked - a different company) broke away from Plessey and formed their own small company. They solved the problem and implemented it by changing components (resistors :facepalm on the original pcb's.. then started selling the product.

Naturally the CEO at Plessey flew off the handle and started a patent lawsuit.
The developers laughed and over the 2 years of the lawsuit, flooded the market with the device. The lawsuit failed for Plessey on the grounds of component changes to the pcb. They made their money.

I think they eventually came to a deal.. the CEO disappeared a year or two later.

 

[Thunder Chicken]

The problem isn't just between Blue Origin and SpaceX. There are things called patent trolls, companies that will buy up patents and simply wait for someone to infringe, then litigate. Because of the ridiculous process patents the USPTO has allowed (particularly in regard to software), this is actually a viable money-making business model.

The best thing might be for SpaceX and Blue Origin to just get the patent jointly just to block these sorts of trolls, agreeing that the concept is really open. Probably won't happen because competition, but I think that would be the smart strategy.

 

[Urwumpe]

The fun is, that the same patent trolls right now try to make the European Patent laws like the US laws, while most here want them to be like the German laws.

In German law, you can't patent software at all, you can only patent concrete implementations of an algorithm. In most cases, you even need a hardware implementation for getting the patent granted. It takes a lot of effort for getting a patent, but then get the same protection then compared to the lousy US patent laws.