# Simpit Outside Visualization

#### bpops

##### Simpit Builder
Donator
The current built in engine can't do it. I can't remember the reason (it is somewhere in this forum though) but any OVP client won't have that limitation. I am not sure about the DX7 client of the current in-dev version, but as Martin simply detached it from the core I doubt it broke that limitation.

I can verify that the curent Direct X OVP client does not run in the higher resolutions.

#### BHawthorne

##### Simpit Builder
Donator
Someone mentioned that Orbiter Direct X should be capable of outputting to the full Matrox TH2G resolution (3840 x 1024 if I remember right). Is this something that could be 'easily' fixed? Or does anyone even know why Orbiter crashes at resolution of over ~2000px wide?

BTW, full TH2G Digital is 5040x1050 (3x 22") while the old obsolete TH2G analog is only 3840x1024. I would prefer the idea be to push the capability to not need a $300 Matrox box though. While I do have them (th2g digital, th2g analog and 2x dh2g digital), the average player would not. It's an unneeded expense if properly accounted for in the client. #### bpops ##### Simpit Builder Donator BTW, full TH2G Digital is 5040x1050 (3x 22") while the old obsolete TH2G analog is only 3840x1024. I would prefer the idea be to push the capability to not need a$300 Matrox box though. While I do have them (th2g digital, th2g analog and 2x dh2g digital), the average player would not. It's an unneeded expense if properly accounted for in the client.

I don't understand this comment. All the box does is output the resolution given to it to three monitors -- the computer sees the box as a single very wide monitor. To 'not need' it has nothing at all to do with Orbiter, it has to do with the size monitors available. Fixing the resolution limit on Orbiter would solve the problem by itself, with no concern for the TH2G.

Also, I do have an analog TH2G, that's why I put 3840.. bought mine just before they released the digital version

#### Hielor

##### Defender of Truth
Donator
Beta Tester
I don't understand this comment. All the box does is output the resolution given to it to three monitors -- the computer sees the box as a single very wide monitor. To 'not need' it has nothing at all to do with Orbiter, it has to do with the size monitors available. Fixing the resolution limit on Orbiter would solve the problem by itself, with no concern for the TH2G.

I believe he's referring to the suggestions that have been thrown around to make Orbiter behave like FSX on multiple monitors.

#### BHawthorne

##### Simpit Builder
Donator
I don't understand this comment. All the box does is output the resolution given to it to three monitors -- the computer sees the box as a single very wide monitor. To 'not need' it has nothing at all to do with Orbiter, it has to do with the size monitors available. Fixing the resolution limit on Orbiter would solve the problem by itself, with no concern for the TH2G.

Also, I do have an analog TH2G, that's why I put 3840.. bought mine just before they released the digital version

To clarify it to you in such a way that might make more sense... The client could be coded to have similar features as MSFS where you can open several camera windows. That way you just throw as many camera windows open as you have video outs to screens. No need for a $300 chunk of hardware from Matrox. That'll require work to achieve though. The only reason why TH2G exists is because the lack of foresight by the 3D client developers. If they had multi-display in mind to begin with the TH2G would be a real expensive paperweight. A hardware solution sets the bar way too high for multi-display options. One should not have to be required to fork out$300 to play games on multi-screen. It's already expensive enough to have to buy multi-display without adding in a hardware splitter box from Matrox. I'm saying this as a person that has had a TH2G since the first week the analog was released and I have all of them DH2G and TH2G analog and digital. I didn't buy them because I liked Matrox. I bought them because game developers don't have the foresight to make games multi-display.

#### TSPenguin

##### The Seeker
It is entirely possible to run in windowed mode and eliminate the need for a hardware solution. How well this will do for outputing to screens on different cards, I do not know.
AFAIK it should be no problem at all connecting two OVP clients to the core. How one will control them I do not know, but there should be a simple solution codable that does not require tabbing (AutoHotKey i.e.) if such a feature is not included.
/2cents

#### Hielor

##### Defender of Truth
Donator
Beta Tester
It is entirely possible to run in windowed mode and eliminate the need for a hardware solution. How well this will do for outputing to screens on different cards, I do not know.
AFAIK it should be no problem at all connecting two OVP clients to the core. How one will control them I do not know, but there should be a simple solution codable that does not require tabbing (AutoHotKey i.e.) if such a feature is not included.
/2cents

Windowed mode is currently undesirable due to the window frame.

#### BHawthorne

##### Simpit Builder
Donator
Windowed mode is currently undesirable due to the window frame.

There are some games that allow the window frame to be turned off in preferences for windowed mode. Warhammer Online has a great implementation of that particular option as an example. It's still "windowed mode" but has no frame rendered.

#### TSPenguin

##### The Seeker
I know a lot of programs that don't care about the current resolution when drawing there window and allow for the frame to be out of the visible area. By specifying the current resolution they either draw the 3D with already frames out of bounds or require you to move the window a bit.
It should be easy to implement a frameless solution, I have seen quite a few applications that don't have frames.

#### Hielor

##### Defender of Truth
Donator
Beta Tester
There are some games that allow the window frame to be turned off in preferences for windowed mode. Warhammer Online has a great implementation of that particular option as an example. It's still "windowed mode" but has no frame rendered.

Yup, World of Warcraft has the same thing. It has an option for "Windowed Mode" which is in a normal window, and then it has a sub-option for "Maximize" which brings it to full size and hides the frame. I always played in maximized windowed mode, because the performance wasn't noticeably worse than fullscreen, but I could alt-tab in a quarter of a second rather than five seconds.

#### BHawthorne

##### Simpit Builder
Donator
I know a lot of programs that don't care about the current resolution when drawing there window and allow for the frame to be out of the visible area. By specifying the current resolution they either draw the 3D with already frames out of bounds or require you to move the window a bit.
It should be easy to implement a frameless solution, I have seen quite a few applications that don't have frames.

The example I'm speaking of actually doesn't render the frame at all, instead of pushing it outside of the viewable area. With multi-display you need it not to render the window frame or it'll push it into the other displays.

#### TSPenguin

##### The Seeker
The example I'm speaking of actually doesn't render the frame at all, instead of pushing it outside of the viewable area. With multi-display you need it not to render the window frame or it'll push it into the other displays.

I understand that. Good point. And now that you mentioned it, it is really annoying. But as I said earlier, an OVP client should easily be made frameless. I'll talk to Artlav about it.
I have a vague memory of a tool (quite old though) that could remove the frame from some games, maybe such an application could be used on the current incarnation of orbiter.

#### BHawthorne

##### Simpit Builder
Donator
Seems like it'll be pretty cool conceptually. Single core with multiple instances of OVP pushing to seperate screens each with their own camera settings.

Could this work across several machines? Just have OVP on another machine point to a network directory of the core? How does the transfer of information work between OVP and the core? If it doesn't work that way can it be made to work that way?

On a single machine, you could push to up to 14 displays using the new ASUS P6T7 motherboard. With what I have sitting around I could only push to 8 displays per motherboard though. My test setup will probably be using a 4-slot PCIe 16x mobo with each video card having 2 outs = 8 Dell P1110 21" CRT displays. I could mix in up to 3 projectors for front view. Should be a very interesting proof of concept for those wanting to simpit build. Although it will look like a jumble of hardware without the simpit shell, but that's not the point.

Testbed hardware:

#### Hielor

##### Defender of Truth
Donator
Beta Tester
Seems like it'll be pretty cool conceptually. Single core with multiple instances of OVP pushing to seperate screens each with their own camera settings.

Could this work across several machines? Just have OVP on another machine point to a network directory of the core? How does the transfer of information work between OVP and the core? If it doesn't work that way can it be made to work that way?
Don't think it would be that easy.

On a single machine, you could push to up to 14 displays using the new ASUS P6T7 motherboard. With what I have sitting around I could only push to 8 displays per motherboard though.
"only"....
My test setup will probably be using a 4-slot PCIe 16x mobo with each video card having 2 outs = 8 Dell P1110 21" CRT displays.
What mobo is that?
Testbed hardware:
I would like to move that your forum subtitle (or whatever it's called, the thing next to your name on the left) be changed to "More disposable income than you.":OMG:

#### BHawthorne

##### Simpit Builder
Donator
$150 Foxconn Destroyer mobo and 4$150 GTX260. I was unaware that my "disposable income" has any relevance in this forum.

#### Hielor

##### Defender of Truth
Donator
Beta Tester
$150 Foxconn Destroyer mobo and 4$150 GTX260. I was unaware that my "disposable income" has any relevance in this forum.
Where are you getting these things so cheap?!

#### BHawthorne

##### Simpit Builder
Donator
I'm a mod over at EVGA's community forums. I typically know of all the cheap deals, because I have to police the marketplace subforums there for potential fraud posts. Most of that stuff is either employee pricing program or b-stock from various sources.

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