The Dragonfly and Space Station Building - Why?

[James.Denholm]

I've been looking around the internet and it seems to me like the most popular vessel for station construction is the Dragonfly. I've never used it myself, but it seems like a very complex vessel. Perhaps that's why I've never used it

My two questions are these:

1. Why is it so popular for space station building?

2. Is there any easy guide to it? I looked at the manual, but my brain imploded.

As an added thing to this thread, I've also added a poll to see the usage of it.

 

[chris772]

I (and as a generalisation, most other people) use it because of the radar-typed thing that allows you to track other modules and vehicles. Also because it's very maneuverable (for me atleast).

unless there is some kind of tutorial out there, the best thing to do is break up the manual into sections and read it as you go. Read the into before you launch the scenario, startup (explains its self), controlls/usage when your flying the mission, et cetera. Worked for me.

EDIT: and it is is the most complicated vehicle (atleast in standard package) when it comes to systems.

 

[James.Denholm]

Thanks for the quick reply Chris!

 

[Spicer]

I've actually attempted to launch a Dragonfly on top of a Titan IV CVEL. Fun. I actually don't remember if it worked...I was going throug a stage for awhile...I figured out CVEL and was trying to launch everything...module 1..launch...module 2...launch...PBShuttle...launch. Some things worked...some didn't!

 

[Quick_Nick]

EDIT: and it is is the most complicated vehicle (atleast in standard package) when it comes to systems.

You've never seen the NASSP beta, have you?

And I use the Dragonfly for station construction because it's easy to maneuver and really seems to be the most efficient way to assemble a station. I've never really messed with it's systems though. I just normally use the scenarios where all I need to do is fly like normal.(systems setup already so I can just translate, rotate, and thrust like usual)

 

[Andy44]

I use it as part of my Lunar Transfer System. I keep it docked at the Prefab LEO station and I use it to transfer cargo modules back and forth between the station berths, the shuttle, the lunar transfer vehicle, and to grab them when they are launched with unmanned rockets.

You certainly can launch the DF on a CVEL Titan and even in the space shuttle, although it's a little large and the antennae poke through the bay doors.

The DF electrical system is very involved, but I figured out how to make it work. There is one major flaw, though: You can't shut it down and put the vehicle into long-term storage. So if you use time accel and fly off to the Moon and back, and launch a shuttle or two in the meantime, when you get back to the DF cockpit, the fuel cells are either ruined or full of gas or both. My solution is to never activate it, and just fly it without the virtual cockpit like any other Orbiter vessel.

I also take the DF back to the ground aboard the shuttle orbiter for periodic maintanance, perhaps bringing up a replacement on the same mission.

 

[GregBurch]

The Dragonfly CAN BE complex, but you don't have to get into the complexity to use it. I've launched it in the BSP quite a few times, and almost always use it when I'm developing new station pieces or other on-orbit stuff because it's the only addon that has automagical "thrust balancing" when docked. That alone makes it one of the most valuable elements of the "Orbiter fleet."

 

[Sherrif of Nottingham]

Well, I don't understand who would use it all the time, but I always use it with SSBB, The only problem I ever get is that it out rotates the station/block so it fits on the right side. I dunno if its Greg's blocks, or if the DFly really does that.

The reason I say who would use it all the time is because it doesn't really have the capabilities to make it to the moon, or the ability to for reentry. I have one connected to my ISS, as well as to any station I would be building... at least till I get a RMS up there.

 

[SlyCoopersButt]

I've played with it a little bit, Never tried connecting station modules with one though. And as OP said, everything about the electrical system was WAY above my head. Very complicated as I'm not very book smart when it comes to such things. But I'll likely use it the easy way when I plan on building with Kulch's station parts with a dedicated launch with one.

 

[chris772]

You've never seen the NASSP beta, have you?

And I use the Dragonfly for station construction because it's easy to maneuver and really seems to be the most efficient way to assemble a station. I've never really messed with it's systems though. I just normally use the scenarios where all I need to do is fly like normal.(systems setup already so I can just translate, rotate, and thrust like usual)

Yes, actually I have the latest beta. and if you didn't notice I said in the standard version (as in with no addons).

 

[RangerPL]

I took the dragonfly, slapped an RMS on it and turned it into a space station utility vehicle (SSUV?).

 

[James.Denholm]

Thanks for the replies guys! Just a second question (groan), when using a RMS, if I lined two modules up perfectly and moved one back, would it dock them? Does that make sense?

 

[Travis Reed]

The DF electrical system is very involved, but I figured out how to make it work. There is one major flaw, though: You can't shut it down and put the vehicle into long-term storage. So if you use time accel and fly off to the Moon and back, and launch a shuttle or two in the meantime, when you get back to the DF cockpit, the fuel cells are either ruined or full of gas or both. My solution is to never activate it, and just fly it without the virtual cockpit like any other Orbiter vessel.

I have actually shut down a running DF in the past to save it's fuel cells. It's been awhile though, so I'd probably have to re-familiarize myself with it.

Personally I don't use the DF much, but then again, I don't build stations. I've experimented with it, of course...but that's been some time ago...I found it lacked a RMS as not everything has a docking port to spare for being maneuvered...I suppose that can be fixed now with URMS...

 

[Andy44]

If you know how to successfully shut down a DF for long term storage, please post a checklist!

 

[Travis Reed]

The checklist for it is in the documentation. I just ran through it again to make sure it works, and it does.

Checklist can be found on Page 10, section G (Dragonfly.pdf found in the Docs folder in your Orbiter root).


-----Posted Added-----


Scary thing is...with some of the other addons I've been using, the DF is fairly simple now...I'd have to consult the docs when it comes time to purge the cells and all that (for the specific numbers)

 

[ar81]

How would a dragonfly could move center of mass to adjust thrust in real life?

 

[Zatnikitelman]

I don't think it moves the CoG so much as it alters the firing and strength of the thrusters.
I used it a lot when I was building my Jump Station so long ago. If you want to launch it inside a launch vehicle, find the Dragonfly Lite on OH. It uses the same stuff as the stock Dragonfly, but is smaller so it fits inside a 5m fairing/payload bay.
To shut down, just turn off all the fuel cells, and don't route the battery to anything. It doesn't need power just to sit around (or even use the thrusters).

 

[ar81]

What I mean is "how a real DF would realize about how much mass it carries and how it is distributed."

 

[davidsinn]

What I mean is "how a real DF would realize about how much mass it carries and how it is distributed."

I don't think it could. You would have to tell it.

 

[Biscuit]

What I mean is "how a real DF would realize about how much mass it carries and how it is distributed."

I would think the easiest way would be to have pressure sensors mounted in the docking clamp on the front.

When something docks, the internal system could do a controlled miniscule thrust forward then back ... not enough to move more than a few inches, but enough to put pressure on the sensors.

The computer could then judge the total mass of the payload, and the horizontal/vertical distribution ... then by doing miniscule vertical then horizontal translational burns it should be able to find the center of mass in the Z axis.

I could see it all being done in a matter of a few seconds by the onboard computer (if not less)... the only thing the pilot would see would be some quick burns by all the thrusters upon docking.

Let the computer do all the work.

... well ... it works in my head anyway.