# ProjectVesselBuilder for Orbiter

#### jacquesmomo

So after doing several tests, I got the same issue as DaveS....

When trying to add 2 animations (No. 65 and 66) - one is "translation", the other is "rotation" - the parameters (reference point, axis, angle for the first, shift for the second) were not saved.

These are 2 animations (ANIMCOMP_65 and ANIMCOMP_66) that I added to SEQ 9 (ANIM_9) for the 4th mesh (MESH_3_NAME = Cessna\Cessna_Wreck)
And so now, ANIM_9 has 4 ANIMCOMP_

So I had to edit the VB<my_cessna>.cfg file and put the values "manually ".
and now it works fine....

I think it is the first time that I have this problem....

#### jacquesmomo

Hello everybody
Hello Fred18

(this message is especially for Fred whom I thank again and again !!!)
(and sorry for my english... from france !)

So, about the settings not registering (sometimes), this also happened to me... sometimes.
It doesn't matter, just edit the VB*.cfg file.

As I think I have a good experience of your module I just wanted to point out 3 anomalies to you if ever one day you have time to correct them, but once again it is not very serious.

1) When saving a scn, there are issues with saving the "scale" state in the animations, when combined with other animations.

In the following example:
• the skis have a translation movement, no problem
• the handle has rotation + translation no problem
• The rope scale only no problem
• the skier has scale+translation+rotation movements: the position is wrong when restarting (Current state).scn or saving scn.

2) If we link an animation to an event (for example if speed above 100 => animation nn START)
you can start or stop the animation.... only if it is like "GO&STOP.
On the other hand if it is "REVERSE" or "RESTART" it can be started, but not stopped.

3) For "PLAY SOUND" EVENTS the recorded path should be different :

For me (with my computer) I will have (for example) :

D:\ORBITER 2016 Europa2\Sound\_CustomVesselsSounds\Cessna\Cessna_crash.wav

Because my Orbiter is in the folder D:\ORBITER 2016 Europa2\
which will not be the case for another user.

The solution is very easy : I edit the VB*.cfg file and put instead:

EVENT_0_SNDFILE = Sound\_CustomVesselsSounds\Cessna\Cessna_crash.wav

and there it works regardless of the Orbiter installation folder.

Here was a summary of these little things that I had noticed, but overall... your module is GREAT!!! ?

#### Gargantua2024

##### The Desktop Orbinaut
Orienting two same meshes into different directions is not possible on VB:

This is the result I want to see

But upon reloading Orbiter, this happens (the second mesh on the background that was inverted above follows the direction of the first identical mesh on the foreground)

This is while making Space Station Freedom out of Max-Q's ISS Meshes resource
Here's the code:
Code:
MESH_0_NAME = 54
MESH_0_POS = 8.35 0 0
MESH_0_DIR = -1 0 6.12323e-017
MESH_0_ROT = 0 1 0
MESH_0_VIS = 1

MESH_1_NAME = 54
MESH_1_POS = -8.35 0 0
MESH_1_DIR = -1 0 6.12323e-017
MESH_1_ROT = 0 1 0
MESH_1_VIS = 1

#### fred18

Donator
Orienting two same meshes into different directions is not possible on VB:

This is the result I want to see
View attachment 28407

But upon reloading Orbiter, this happens (the second mesh on the background that was inverted above follows the direction of the first identical mesh on the foreground)
View attachment 28406

This is while making Space Station Freedom out of Max-Q's ISS Meshes resource
Here's the code:
Code:
MESH_0_NAME = 54
MESH_0_POS = 8.35 0 0
MESH_0_DIR = -1 0 6.12323e-017
MESH_0_ROT = 0 1 0
MESH_0_VIS = 1

MESH_1_NAME = 54
MESH_1_POS = -8.35 0 0
MESH_1_DIR = -1 0 6.12323e-017
MESH_1_ROT = 0 1 0
MESH_1_VIS = 1
It is possible, but IIRC it was mentioned in the docs:
Code:
Meshes: it is not yet confirmed but it is possible that the same mesh loaded multiple times with
different rotations can cause issues. In order to avoid that if there is a situation where this
particular configuration is needed please make copies of the mesh file and give different names to
each.
the best way then is to make a copy of the mesh and use 2 different names, then it should work.

Hello everybody
Hello Fred18

(this message is especially for Fred whom I thank again and again !!!)
(and sorry for my english... from france !)

So, about the settings not registering (sometimes), this also happened to me... sometimes.
It doesn't matter, just edit the VB*.cfg file.

As I think I have a good experience of your module I just wanted to point out 3 anomalies to you if ever one day you have time to correct them, but once again it is not very serious.

1) When saving a scn, there are issues with saving the "scale" state in the animations, when combined with other animations.

In the following example:
• the skis have a translation movement, no problem
• the handle has rotation + translation no problem
• The rope scale only no problem
• the skier has scale+translation+rotation movements: the position is wrong when restarting (Current state).scn or saving scn.

View attachment 28173

2) If we link an animation to an event (for example if speed above 100 => animation nn START)
you can start or stop the animation.... only if it is like "GO&STOP.
On the other hand if it is "REVERSE" or "RESTART" it can be started, but not stopped.

3) For "PLAY SOUND" EVENTS the recorded path should be different :

For me (with my computer) I will have (for example) :

D:\ORBITER 2016 Europa2\Sound\_CustomVesselsSounds\Cessna\Cessna_crash.wav

Because my Orbiter is in the folder D:\ORBITER 2016 Europa2\
which will not be the case for another user.

The solution is very easy : I edit the VB*.cfg file and put instead:

EVENT_0_SNDFILE = Sound\_CustomVesselsSounds\Cessna\Cessna_crash.wav

and there it works regardless of the Orbiter installation folder.

Here was a summary of these little things that I had noticed, but overall... your module is GREAT!!! ?

Thank you very much! This is super helpful and useful. When I find sometime I will definitely check all this!

#### jedidia

##### shoemaker without legs
Fred, since you're around and might be listening right now, pleeeeease make this thing open source. It's about the best tool for simple vessel building we have right now and beats Vinkas vessel4 in every aspect, especially compatibility. But people are a bit reluctant to use it, because the builds are nowhere available except in this forum, and things might just go incompatible when a new orbiter build is released (which might be more frequent now that it's open source).

We were just talking about the importance of tooling in the orbiter open source thread a while ago, and this is a great tool. I would hate to see it vanish into the night.

As for the meshes issue, are you maybe modifying the global mesh template loaded into orbiter instead of the actual mesh instance that is received by the vessel?

#### fred18

Donator
Fred, since you're around and might be listening right now, pleeeeease make this thing open source. It's about the best tool for simple vessel building we have right now and beats Vinkas vessel4 in every aspect, especially compatibility. But people are a bit reluctant to use it, because the builds are nowhere available except in this forum, and things might just go incompatible when a new orbiter build is released (which might be more frequent now that it's open source).

We were just talking about the importance of tooling in the orbiter open source thread a while ago, and this is a great tool. I would hate to see it vanish into the night.

As for the meshes issue, are you maybe modifying the global mesh template loaded into orbiter instead of the actual mesh instance that is received by the vessel?
Well, since I was way optimistic on the time I would have found for maintaining this project at the beginning, and since I have not opened orbiter since like 2 years or something it does not make any sense to keep the code for me. I just ask, please, to anyone using it to respect and give credits, that's it.

https://github.com/fredenigma/VesselBuilder1

Relevant to the meshes issue, I vaguely remember that it was something like that, but that there was no way around for some built in reason (maybe related to D3D9 compatibility) that I really cannot remember now.

#### jedidia

##### shoemaker without legs
Relevant to the meshes issue, I vaguely remember that it was something like that, but that there was no way around for some built in reason (maybe related to D3D9 compatibility) that I really cannot remember now.
I did this for IMS, so it's possible. I think you have to use DevMeshEx or something, but I'm really not sure anymore.
In any case, thanks a lot for making this open source!

#### jacquesmomo

Bonjour

@ Fred
Hi !!!
I also found another small bug but not very serious.
I'll explain that to you later. it's just a problem of copying the "EVENTS" section from config_0 to config_1 if we modify this section....

I need some help... but I don't know if anyone has the solution..

Let me explain :

I would like my Cessna to refuel when it is in this maintenance hangar. (there is the same hangar in all the small towns of French Guyana)
I remind you that this Cessna is a "VesselBuilder" vessel that's why I put this post here.

I have positioned an LPAD in this hangar..(declared in the base cfg file of this area)

So once the aircraft is stationary, refueling should be done.

Except that... sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. ?

And I found why: in order for this fueling function to work, the vessel must go from the state "ORBITING" to the state "LANDED".

And it turns out that this aircraft usually stays in the "ORBITING" state even though it appears to be stationary, even with the "BRAKE" function activated.

I think there is a problem with my contact points: wrong setting of STIFFNESS or DAMPING ?
Here they are (cfg VB file)

;<-------------------------TOUCHDOWNPOINTS DEFINITIONS------------------------->

TDP_1_0_POS = 0 -2.17 5
TDP_1_0_STIFFNESS = 100000
TDP_1_0_DAMPING = 3000
TDP_1_0_MU = 10
TDP_1_0_MULNG = 0.5

TDP_1_1_POS = -8.5 -2.15 -3
TDP_1_1_STIFFNESS = 100000
TDP_1_1_DAMPING = 3000
TDP_1_1_MU = 10
TDP_1_1_MULNG = 0.5

TDP_1_2_POS = 8.5 -2.15 -3
TDP_1_2_STIFFNESS = 100000
TDP_1_2_DAMPING = 3000
TDP_1_2_MU = 10
TDP_1_2_MULNG = 0.5

TDP_1_3_POS = 0 0.5 10
TDP_1_3_STIFFNESS = 30000
TDP_1_3_DAMPING = 3000
TDP_1_3_MU = 10
TDP_1_3_MULNG = 0.5

TDP_1_4_POS = -8.5 1.58 -10
TDP_1_4_STIFFNESS = 30000
TDP_1_4_DAMPING = 3000
TDP_1_4_MU = 10
TDP_1_4_MULNG = 0.5

TDP_1_5_POS = 8.5 1.58 -10
TDP_1_5_STIFFNESS = 30000
TDP_1_5_DAMPING = 3000
TDP_1_5_MU = 10
TDP_1_5_MULNG = 0.5

If someone has an idea....

This is my last issue to solve.
Otherwise this Cessna runs great!!!!

#### jedidia

##### shoemaker without legs
I agree that your issue is most likely related to the touchdown points. Unfortunately, they are a bit of an art, and heavily depending on your vessels mass... You might have to experiment around a bit.
One thing to keep in mind is that it's always the first three points that determine landed state. One thing a bit odd I can see with your definitions is that they seem to be a bit far apart. Like, you have 8 meters of distance between the front wheel and the rear wheels. I'm not an aviator, but I don't remember Cesnas being that large...

#### N_Molson

Donator
Yes it has to do with those parameters, this issue is not specific to VesselBuilder. Nothing is really wrong, but you have to enter accurate values that require some high-grade maths.

You can use ParkingBrakeMFD as an alternative.

#### fred18

Donator
There should be a built in "parking brake" option in VB. Try to press CTRL+. (OAPI_KEY_PERIOD) and check if that does anything good. The proper way would be to force the landed status, but I am pretty sure there is a reason why I did not do that . Give it a try

#### jacquesmomo

@ jedidia : Yes, I know it's only the first 3 points that are useful for "touching" .
I know the triangle is a little big, but I did many tests and trials, and this value is suitable because the plane had to be able to turn on the ground etc etc.
Of course it also depends on the weight, but it's too late for me to change these parameters: if I change only one element, then I would have to modify all the other parameters (wing surfaces, resistance, flaps, trim etc etc)
...as I would like to upload this add-on before the summer.... may be a Tuesday ???

I will therefore try to (again) modify the contact points, but as you say: it is a bit of art....
(in French we say "hasardeux" (hazardous)....

@ N_molson : correct... but, although I am a doctor, my level of math stops at the last year of lycée... (only if I remember what normalized vectors are....)

@ Fred18 : Of course... I tried both. (Ctrl+. - Ctrl+: for the French keyboard) and parkingBrakeMFD. It doesn't work.... ?

So I only have 2 options left:
• either find a value of the contact points that work better (I have already spent quite a bit of time on this)
• either increase the capacity of the tank.... (I did it but it's not very realistic to have more than 1185 km (found on internet) )

Otherwise (I explain it in the doc) it will be enough to edit the "scn" file and put PRPLEVEL 0.1000000

I now come here very often, the French forum being unfortunately little frequented ( except Pappy2) since the disappearance of Dan's networks.... ?

#### N_Molson

Donator
So I only have 2 options left:

Nonono if Parking Brake MFD doesn't work, there's something very wrong going on, and you have to chase down the bug first.

I now come here very often, the French forum being unfortunately little frequented

We can use the "International" section of OF. But I think it is a good thing for everyone we all share our ideas in English, even if that's not easy for us. ?

#### jacquesmomo

Nonono if Parking Brake MFD doesn't work, there's something very wrong going on, and you have to chase down the bug first.
sure.... ???

We can use the "International" section of OF. But I think it is a good thing for everyone we all share our ideas in English, even if that's not easy for us. ?
sure !!!

#### llarian

##### Well-known member
I don't bother with the "International" section of OF. If I need information from the international side I usually head to DanSteph's forums. Google translate hasn't failed me yet.

#### Thymo

##### I like breaking things
Well, since I was way optimistic on the time I would have found for maintaining this project at the beginning, and since I have not opened orbiter since like 2 years or something it does not make any sense to keep the code for me. I just ask, please, to anyone using it to respect and give credits, that's it.

https://github.com/fredenigma/VesselBuilder1

Hi Fred,
Thanks so much for providing the sources for VeselBuilder on GitHub.
However, legally no one can distribute or make any modifications to your project because it does not have a license. This makes it All Rights Reserved by default.

From your post I understand you only want people to provide proper attribution and maintain copyright notices. If I may make a suggestion, the MIT license would be a perfect candidate to achieve this. To make this as easy as possible I've created a pull request proposing the changes needed to add the license: https://github.com/fredenigma/VesselBuilder1/pull/1
If you want more details on why it is important to release your software under a license feel free to ask or take a look here https://choosealicense.com/no-permission/

#### Thymo

##### I like breaking things
Hi @fred18 , would you be willing to merge this so people can use VesselBuilder with the MIT license?

#### fred18

Donator
Hi @fred18 , would you be willing to merge this so people can use VesselBuilder with the MIT license?
Hi Sorry for the delayed answer, I have many things going on at the same time... all the time . Now I'm no expert at all on Github (I should be but I am totally not...) so I think I have accepted and merged your pull request but I am not sure if that worked. Would you please check? Thank you in advance for your help and suggestion!

Perfect, thanks!

#### Gato Mafioso

##### New member
Well, since I was way optimistic on the time I would have found for maintaining this project at the beginning, and since I have not opened orbiter since like 2 years or something it does not make any sense to keep the code for me. I just ask, please, to anyone using it to respect and give credits, that's it.

https://github.com/fredenigma/VesselBuilder1

Relevant to the meshes issue, I vaguely remember that it was something like that, but that there was no way around for some built in reason (maybe related to D3D9 compatibility) that I really cannot remember now.
how to install Vessel builder? im new to the game, and some Scenarios needs it, but idk how to install it

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