In need of graphics card

[Quick_Nick]

I'm hoping to get a graphics card for my computer soon to run some 3D games better, but need serious help in choosing the right one. :sos: At the moment, I have no real graphics card, just a built-in chipset. My computer isn't exactly new or top-of-the-line but I'm sure I can find something compatible. I know I need a PCI card.(tell me it will actually improve SOMETHING, please! :lol According to this and other info on my motherboard(0WF887), my motherboard seems to support DDR. Does this mean that I can't use DDR2 memory on the graphics card?... or does it mean I just can't use DDR2 with the motherboard?(some people seem to suggest that the graphics card can use any type while the computer/motherboard is restricted) As other info, my system model is Dell DE051. I have 512MB RAM(two 256MB sticks), and the previous link shows that I should be able to upgrade RAM without using pairs. One graphics card package that I saw at the store today came with 512MB DDR2 RAM for use with the computer(the card was 256MB). More RAM would likely be helpful, but I can't even consider this package if I can't use DDR2 anyways. As some final information, some specific games I'm hoping to play and have improved are Half-Life 2 series/mod games and Spore when it is released.(I won't even hope for improvement of FSX:rofl Besides a hope of increased framerate, some features of a graphics card such as Shader support and higher DirectX will hopefully improve looks.
I'm thinking that a card like this(though I'm not really 'choosing' this card as I just found it through Google quickly) probably has an ideal set of specifications: http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=V5200-P256&cat=VCD
It's PCI, it's DDR, it supports DirectX 9(I think 10 would be unnecessary since it was not compatible with XP last time I checked anyways), and I'm just guessing that 256MB is a good amount here.
I think I'll put a maximum price at about $200. One that expensive is probably too good for my computer anyways. Most of the 'fitting' cards I saw at the store were right around $100.

Any help will be greatly appreciated!

 

[Ursus]

(Looking at the specs page [Edit: Seems to be the wrong specs page.] for your computer...)

Woah... that's an ancient computer... Looks like it does have an AGP 2x slot, also. I didn't realize they even made PCI video cards any more.

I'd think that a better upgrade would be to extract the disk drives and build a new computer around them. (Except that might mean having to scrounge up a new copy of XP... grumble... grumble...)

Edit: (IMHO)

 

[Chode]

If you have an AGP 2x slot, you might consider an NVidia GeForce 7600 card. I think you can get these for under $100 US now. My main machine is running one of these, and the performance is reasonable for recent games (and Orbiter). Graphics cards are like another computer inside your computer, so if a graphics card says it uses DDR2, it means that the data from graphics card memory to graphics chips is DDR2 speed, which is not limited by your CPU or bus speed.

Regards

 

[Quick_Nick]

I'm almost 100% certain I only have PCI.(unfortunately ) I've actually got a better computer model in the living room but that is sort of my mom's. The one I intend on upgrading is the one I always use. Also, thanks for the DDR info Chode.
I might consider getting a new computer if: 1. We really had the money and 2. We hadn't bought these two computers only a couple of years ago. For now, I'm stuck with this...

 

[James.Denholm]

One word: Alienware.

One problem: $5,000.

Ring me if you win the lottery!

 

[pete.dakota]

According to this and other info on my motherboard(0WF887), my motherboard seems to support DDR. Does this mean that I can't use DDR2 memory on the graphics card?... or does it mean I just can't use DDR2 with the motherboard?

As long as your motherboard can accept the graphics card, it doesn't matter what memory it has. For instance, my mobo is only compatible with DDR RAM, but my X1950 Pro AGP has DDR3 RAM.

As other info, my system model is Dell DE051. I have 512MB RAM(two 256MB sticks), and the previous link shows that I should be able to upgrade RAM without using pairs.

You could upgrade to 768 by buying a single 512 stick (so you would have 256+512). Or buy two 512 sticks, throw away the 256s and have 1G. Which is what I would suggest, I mean, if you're wanting to play NEW PC games (or Orbiter with hires ) you're going to have to have at least 1G RAM.

One graphics card package that I saw at the store today came with 512MB DDR2 RAM for use with the computer(the card was 256MB). More RAM would likely be helpful, but I can't even consider this package if I can't use DDR2 anyways.

Yeah, don't get that package. Your mobo won't take DDR2 RAM.

As some final information, some specific games I'm hoping to play and have improved are Half-Life 2 series/mod games and Spore when it is released.(I won't even hope for improvement of FSX:rofl

I expect with a Geforce FX 5500, 1G of DDR RAM and your 2.8ghz Celeron that you would be able to RUN HL2, you could probably get some decent performance out of it. Maybe 2xAA with some AF at your full res. How well some of source mod's HDR and episodes one and two will render though, don't be too confident. (I have an AMD64 3400+, 2G DDR RAM and an X1950 Pro 512MB AGP and can only just run episode 2 on full settings at 1440x900 res.)

I'm thinking that a card like this(though I'm not really 'choosing' this card as I just found it through Google quickly) probably has an ideal set of specifications: http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=V5200-P256&cat=VCD
It's PCI, it's DDR, it supports DirectX 9(I think 10 would be unnecessary since it was not compatible with XP last time I checked anyways), and I'm just guessing that 256MB is a good amount here.

That card looks good for your rig, maybe try and get your hands on a 5500, though. Just to get the most of your setup. Without PCIx16 or AGP, I don't think you'll find a card that has more than 256MB texture memory, you certainly won't find a card that is DX10 compatible. And any DX10 game probably wouldn't run on a single core processor, anyway, at least, not at all well, considering the amount of physics involved.

 

[streb2001]

Check inside for the AGP slot. If it is there I would recommend the NVidia 7600. I too have a pretty old machine with onboard GPU. Recently treated myself to the 7600 and, well, WOW......

Level 10 textures, all the pretties switched on the frame rate jumped 500%! Less so with full antialiasing but still amazing. I really had no idea that adding a better card could make such a huge difference.

 

[Ursus]

I'm almost 100% certain I only have PCI.(unfortunately )

Hmmm... (Oops...) Looks like you're right. I could've sworn the specs page I found was directly off a page for the Dell DE051, but now that I take a second look at it... It doesn't seem to match the specs I find when I look up the motherboard (which seems easier to find).

(Ok... where's that corner in which to sit?)

 

[Chode]

If you definitely need a PCI graphics card, then you might look at this one:

Diamond Multimedia S9250 PCI 256SB

this is about as good as your going to get for a PCI card.

Regards

 

[Quick_Nick]

If you definitely need a PCI graphics card, then you might look at this one:

Diamond Multimedia S9250 PCI 256SB

this is about as good as your going to get for a PCI card.

Regards

I was considering a GeForce FX 5500 for a while. I found your mentioned card here which actually does seem to be better. The vast number(two:lol of reviews look great... almost like Dell propaganda. Anyways, thanks, I'll probably consider getting this one most unless something better shows up.:speakcool:

 

[pete.dakota]

I was considering a GeForce FX 5500 for a while. I found your mentioned card here which actually does seem to be better. The vast number(two:lol of reviews look great... almost like Dell propaganda. Anyways, thanks, I'll probably consider getting this one most unless something better shows up.:speakcool:

One thing you should consider, is that you have an intel processor, nvidia cards are MUCH more compatiable with intel chipsets then AMD cards. The 'diamond multimedia' GPU is essentially an AMD ATI 9250, which is likely to be less compatiable. It will still work, obviously, but you may experience some problems.

If I had an intel processor/chipset I would only ever buy nvidia graphics cards.

 

[Quick_Nick]

So does this mean that you are suggesting I get the 5500? I haven't found much else that meets what I need.

 

[jarmonik]

So does this mean that you are suggesting I get the 5500? I haven't found much else that meets what I need.

I suppose your build-in graphics card has "Intel Extreme 2" chipset providing 1.0GT (GigaTexels) fill rate. FX 5500 will do NO better.

here are pretty good performance charts for Intel graphics cards:
http://www.techarp.com/showarticle.aspx?artno=88&pgno=20

here are Nvidia Cards:
http://www.techarp.com/showarticle.aspx?artno=88&pgno=4


EDIT:
I don't think there exists a PCI card that would be better than the existing one. I suppose the build-in card is using AGP 8x

EDIT2:
I hope you don't confuse PCI and PCIe

 

[Quick_Nick]

I don't have a graphics 'card' really, just a built-in controller. It's an Intel 82865G Graphics Controller with 96MB RAM. It uses Extreme Graphics 2 but I don't know much else. I think anything would have to be much better. There are so many features that my chipset does not have.
Also, I'm sure I do not have PCI and PCIe confused. I will however check my computer again for an AGP slot(not expecting one though) and to check my power supply's power.(although I would expect it to be enough)
EDIT: 2 PCI and I think 250W max.

 

[Quick_Nick]

So, would a 5500 be best or what? From looking at that chart it seems like a 5200 could possibly be even better, but I'm not sure. I need an answer! XD
BTW, I do plan on upgrading to at least 1GB RAM to help.

EDIT: Bought a GeForce 6200 OC and it is working well. Problem solved?

 

[HAWKEYE]

Hey there I am in the exact same situation you are in right now , but there is one particular peice of information I need to know. I have the same model as you also known as B110 , I noticed that card needs a 300W power supply does the B110 have one? Did it actually work for you? Im only getting into modyfying computers as of now since my old dell is falling behinds times , and I dont wan tto open up case until the day I have to
So does it have a 300W power supply,
thanks

 

[Quick_Nick]

I'll have to check later(Monday or late tonight, just remind me if I forget for a few days ) on what my power supply says. However I think that my GeForce 6200 actually asked for only 250W which I think may be what I have. I'm probably getting mixed up between my computers, so I'll just have to check. Anyways my 6200 has worked out really well. I believe it has 256MB RAM and it runs my games well.(I still should get a new computer though! :lol I can play Counter-Strike: Source and other Source games with the only lag being due to internet speed. The only 'issue' that has come up is random white pixels showing up occasionally on webpages and showing up a lot(and 'moving' around) on animated gifs. However, these pixels really don't get in the way of anything, so I wouldn't really complain. EDIT4: Another issue is one I expected. My fan sometimes makes a lot of noise. Usually stopping the fan(with my finger or small object) or just messing with it will fix this but for a month at least I haven't had any problems after I last 'fixed' it.
I'm not sure how easily you'll find a PCI 6200 OC though. I'm sure there are plenty for PCI-e and AGP but not many cards above the 5000s are PCI compatible. I found mine at a local Best Buy. Just look around. I wouldn't suggest getting anything more powerful unless you plan on getting a new computer.
EDIT5:lol:: Welcome to the forum!

btw, I have yet to upgrade my computer's RAM from 512MB.

Edit again?: Also, it shouldn't be too hard to find the Maximum Output(or it should say something similar) wattage on the label on your PSU. I remember it being a little difficult to see without removing the PSU and needing a flashlight, but I did manage to see it.

EDIT3?: Earlier post says that it was 250W

 

[Moonwalker]

A graphics card alone isn't the key to play 3D games enjoyable. Being able to play 3D games, especially flight simulators, sadly requires some more money because you need a good mainboard, CPU and RAM as well. With a cheap and powerless card only you won't be really happy. Even with a good card on a bad mainboard and CPU it's like trying to push a bowling ball through a garden hose.

My suggestion would be to put money aside to buy at least a Nvida 8800 card, a Intel Core 2 Duo CPU and a good Asus mainboard (and of course 2GB RAM). I did so too about a year ago and believe me it was worth the money. Anything else just is wasting money because you always have to reduce settings which reduces the fun too.

 

[HAWKEYE]

Ha thanks I really appreciate, I to want to be able to play dods and improve lagg from RO and other flight sims , I just dont know many of my systems specs which I think is identical to yours and I dont want to look in my case lol , I dont want to fry it or anything, and if it says 250 ,how are you able to run or have I confused certain cards , This is http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage...00+OC&lp=2&type=product&cp=1&id=1130987962366
the card you have right because this is what I plan on getting along with 512 mb of RAM , I cant wait for your answer Ive been wanting to do this for sometime now, Ijust want what comaptible and able to run those hl2 mods and such thank you , (again cant wait)

 

[Quick_Nick]

Ha thanks I really appreciate, I to want to be able to play dods and improve lagg from RO and other flight sims , I just dont know many of my systems specs which I think is identical to yours and I dont want to look in my case lol , I dont want to fry it or anything, and if it says 250 ,how are you able to run or have I confused certain cards , This is http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage...00+OC&lp=2&type=product&cp=1&id=1130987962366
the card you have right because this is what I plan on getting along with 512 mb of RAM , I cant wait for your answer Ive been wanting to do this for sometime now, Ijust want what comaptible and able to run those hl2 mods and such thank you , (again cant wait)

That is the exact card I have(even BFG brand), but my box says only 250W on the system requirements. I did a Google search and most sites except Best Buy say only 250W. I'm thinking that it's just a typo or more of a recommended amount.(I can't see why recommended and minimum would be different though) PSUs supposedly normally have at least 300W anyways. I'd suggest going to a store if there is one nearby and seeing what they have, and if you can't find it(or something better) or don't have a store nearby, buying the one online will probably be just fine.
Also, you probably have the same specs as me and to reassure you, the Source games used to run at what seemed like 1 FPS(couldn't have been much more) and some of the games didn't even run at all. After I got this card, everything runs just fine with the occasional lag in a large area in the HL2 games.(especially the episodes which have enhanced graphics engines) I normally run my games at minimal quality just because I don't care for the small amount of detail that higher settings add, but I've found that I can run the games at higher settings(it will tell you what settings are recommended) just fine. The awesome HDR abilities, however, don't seem work with this card. Overall, this card will give you a significant improvement in gameplay but isn't exactly perfect or top-of-the-line. Another little 'bug' I just remembered is that while most games run well, Orbiter seems to have some issues with my card. If I have Orbiter use my graphics card, it will often run slow and have a few graphics issues. There is an option to run it without using my card but I also have a few visual issues there too, probably because you're supposed to uninstall your graphics controller's drivers before you install the video card's drivers. I use the non-video-card option(and max res 8 as I always have) and the only issue I've seen come up is that the resolution of gradients appears low.(best observable from LEO on the night side of Earth)
EDIT: switching from 16bpp to 32bpp seemed to resolve issues with my graphics card and Orbiter... I'll let you know if I still find problems and any fixes
Also, I want to mention that I never use antialiasing with my card.(again for performance over quality)

And if you go to Start->Run and type in dxdiag and hit Ok, you can get CPU speed and RAM under the System tab and some graphics controller info under Display.
I have 2.53Ghz and 510MB RAM.(I REALLY should upgrade my RAM sometime... and my computer )