End of the good times, in F1?

[Notebook]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7766092.stm

Honda is pulling out of Formula One, blaming the world economic crisis for plans to sell its team

N.

 

[Urwumpe]

Well, the circuit of Hockenheim also plans to withdraw from the F1, blaming the high financial demands from Ecclestone.

 

[Notebook]

Credit crunch hits everything?
Maybe Bernie E. can lower his rates till things pickup. Haven't been to a F1 meeting for 20+ years, though that was the caotic parking that put me off, more than the entrance fee.

N.

 

[Urwumpe]

I think, it would be the right time for starting an all electrical racing series. After all, the Formula 1 was always a technological show case, why not do the same again with a new technology.

 

[simonpro]

Because that would be boring. The reason I watch F1 is to see the drivers trying to control cars at the limits of speed and handling. electric cars are just not fast enough to offer that spectacle.
Although, if Bernie is given his way neither will F1 cars. His plans for conglomerated engine blocks is terrible.

Still, not a surprise to see honda quit. I think it's less abuot the credit crunch and more about the fact they were terrible. Manufacturers get into F1 to showcase their technology and car making skills. Honda couldn't do that very well from the back of the grid

 

[tblaxland]

I think, it would be the right time for starting an all electrical racing series. After all, the Formula 1 was always a technological show case, why not do the same again with a new technology.

I reckon that would be really interesting. F1 is not just a technology showcase but a technology driver also. A high profile electrical (or zero emissions, water allowed?) racing series would be a great way to help new technology. Electric motor and drive technology is quite mature already thanks to a century or so of industrial applications but no doubt there would still be some room for improvement. Batteries is where I would want to see the big investment.

 

[Urwumpe]

Because that would be boring. The reason I watch F1 is to see the drivers trying to control cars at the limits of speed and handling. electric cars are just not fast enough to offer that spectacle.
Although, if Bernie is given his way neither will F1 cars. His plans for conglomerated engine blocks is terrible.

Why? We are no longer talking about cars limited to 40 km/h. Modern electro-cars easily reach 250 km/h, but have the limitation of the battery power.

Still, not a surprise to see honda quit. I think it's less abuot the credit crunch and more about the fact they were terrible. Manufacturers get into F1 to showcase their technology and car making skills. Honda couldn't do that very well from the back of the grid

Yeah, that was likely the main reason - Volkswagen does not take part (directly) inside the F1 out of similar reasons. It would be far too expensive for just driving in the midfield.

I reckon that would be really interesting. F1 is not just a technology showcase but a technology driver also. A high profile electrical (or zero emissions, water allowed?) racing series would be a great way to help new technology. Electric motor and drive technology is quite mature already thanks to a century or so of industrial applications but no doubt there would still be some room for improvement. Batteries is where I would want to see the big investment.

Exactly - of course, the main problem is also the price of the technology, which the F-1 will not really remedy, but still, if this means that battery modules become lighter and smaller, it would already be a huge success.

 

[GregBurch]

I'd be an enthusiastic electric road racing fan. Electric drag racing is picking up speed in America (pun intended), a format that shows off the great torque curve of electrics vs. combustion engines. The battery limitations could be overcome -- pit stops to replace battery packs. They'd be more common at first but that would be part of the appeal. With lower speeds at first, there wouldn't be so much need for restrictive rules. Let the engineers and builders battle it out across a broad type definition. Offer big prizes. It'd be great!

 

[Notebook]

Instead of petrol spillages, its sulphuric acid spillages! Instead of F1 cars dragging hoses behind them down the pit lanes, they'll be dragging carbouys...Showing my age there.
An Electric F1 would be a good idea, just needs a bit of marketing.

N.

 

[Urwumpe]

An Electric F1 would be a good idea, just needs a bit of marketing.

I would start with a small electric race first. Not too big, just for the sport (instead of the marketing). For example, driving 15 circuits around the Nürburgring. No special car rules except they have to be fully electric - no combustion engine allowed. Including hybrids would make the racing currently a bit biased, as the batteries are the limiting factor. Fuel cells could maybe go, would not offer a too big advantage currently.

The distance of 330 km has the advantage, that the cars would require to swap batteries very often currently, with any small improvement in battery capacity or car effectivity having big impact on the race results.


A Mini E for example would require one battery swap according to the manufacturer, but I doubt it will keep the range in racing conditions - I think 2-3 swaps are more likely over such a distance.

 

[Ghostrider]

Why? We are no longer talking about cars limited to 40 km/h. Modern electro-cars easily reach 250 km/h, but have the limitation of the battery power.

That's why nuclear power is your friend, and it would make the competition all the more exciting.:lol:

 

[Eagle]

If they updated the rules to make it closer to F Zero, I'd watch it.

 

[ar81]

Credit crunch hits everything?
Maybe Bernie E. can lower his rates till things pickup. Haven't been to a F1 meeting for 20+ years, though that was the caotic parking that put me off, more than the entrance fee.

N.

No.

Here is how it happens:
1.US Trade deficit leaks money out of US. US liquidity is reduced.
2.US citizens must afford liquidity gap and consumerism with debt they can't pay.
3.Credit crunch comes when debts can't be collected. It becomes evident that buying power is smaller, so jobs are cut to adjust supply to demand.
4.Job cuts make the amount of poor bigger, reducing the amount of customers in the economy.

This is the endless cycle of recession and market shrinking.
Jobs are lost because demand lowered.
Demand is lowered because of unemployment.

Only those goods that are necessary for basic survival will remain.
Anything else, not needed by humans to survive, will suffer.
The world will become a planetary african country if the cycle is not stopped.
Formula 1 is not needed to survive.

 

[GregBurch]

No.

Here is how it happens:
1.US Trade deficit leaks money out of US. US liquidity is reduced.
2.US citizens must afford liquidity gap and consumerism with debt they can't pay.
3.Credit crunch comes when debts can't be collected. It becomes evident that buying power is smaller, so jobs are cut to adjust supply to demand.
4.Job cuts make the amount of poor bigger, reducing the amount of customers in the economy.

This is the endless cycle of recession and market shrinking.
Jobs are lost because demand lowered.
Demand is lowered because of unemployment.

Only those goods that are necessary for basic survival will remain.
Anything else, not needed by humans to survive, will suffer.
The world will become a planetary african country if the cycle is not stopped.
Formula 1 is not needed to survive.

Pablo, with all due respect, you're being hysterical. Really. We're in for a global depression, there's no question about it. None. But it's not the end of civilization, unless people get hysterical and kill the goose that lays the golden eggs because it's got the flu.

Let me make a very strong recommendation to you. Read this book before you continue predicting the end of civilization:

[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Forgotten-Man-History-Great-Depression/dp/0066211700"]Amazon.com: The Forgotten Man: A New History of the Great Depression: Amity Shlaes: Books[/ame]

You'll be amazed at how much you think you know turns out to be wrong.

 

[simonpro]

At least the world is not a videogame this time

 

[Notebook]

You sure don't need F1 to survive, its pure entertainment, if you enjoy it. Some spin-offs to the motor industry in the long term, disc brakes, turbos, monocoque construction.
I think I'll be cutting back on my viewng next season, assuming its on anywhere.

N.

 

[Redburne]

Because that would be boring. The reason I watch F1 is to see the drivers trying to control cars at the limits of speed and handling.

Things went downhill when they found out they could use wings on the cars ...

Please bring back the racing cigars of '67!

Watch the Flugplatz footage at 1:11 or (much better) at 5:00 to see what I'm missing in todays F1 ...

Nürburgring 1967

 

[Ghostrider]

Things went downhill when they found out they could use wings on the cars ...

I don't see anything wrong with wings on cars. In fact, they should add rockets too.

 

[ar81]

The definition of end of civilization is subjective.
For Incas it was the disappearance of their culture, as they were assimilated by Spanish.
End of the world for a teen is when a girl says "no".
End of the world, as I see it, is the end of the endless consumerism, where you have 70 types of jeans to choose from and where you change your car every year and discard clothing that is very usable. Consumerism will not end, but it will not cross the line.
End of the world is also the end of a world which did not care about world poverty.

5% of population consumed 40% of world resources...