Request Realtime terrain generator

[deltawing777]

I would like to request a addon for orbiter that uses the google earth 3d data into orbiter.I know about Orulex or OGLA client anyway to stream the google data into the existing addon? I got this idea from the generic flight simulator built into google earth 3d. I also noticed inside of google earth on one of the tabs called "network link" could this be the key we need? Im not a coder so i dont know. What i do know is if this can be done we could have the whole earth terrain,cities,weather,airports right inside of orbiter. Here's the video that inspired me to write this :

and some info on the network link I found is here: https://earth.google.com/support/bin/static.py?page=guide.cs&guide=22369&topic=27830

---------- Post added at 11:02 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:48 AM ----------

So I was thinking if this cant be done with orbiter 2006 can it be done with Orbiter 2010 with the lua scripting and all. And if so load that module with Faces's OMP module and now you are multiplayer in a cool enviroment at least on earth anyways

 

[cinder1992]

I think OGLA can be modified to accept the data, but from my experience, the data is quite low-res, so it might not be able to do it.

 

[deltawing777]

I think OGLA can be modified to accept the data, but from my experience, the data is quite low-res, so it might not be able to do it.

What is low-rez? google?

 

[Fabri91]

Bandwidth would be a problem I think...there is the TileProxy plugin for FS that does the same thing, but only with textures, and it can barely keep up with the speed of a jetliner, and consider that in orbiter we move quite a bit faster, and that this plugin would also have to get 3d data...

 

[deltawing777]

Bandwidth would be a problem I think...there is the TileProxy plugin for FS that does the same thing, but only with textures, and it can barely keep up with the speed of a jetliner, and consider that in orbiter we move quite a bit faster, and that this plugin would also have to get 3d data...

Google earth flight sim was smooth for me flying around at 600 mph.Bandwith between me and google was fine :thumbup:

 

[garyw]

Wouldn't it be a violation of the terms and conditions?

http://maps.google.com/help/terms_maps_earth.html

(e) use the Products in a manner that gives you or any other person access to mass downloads or bulk feeds of any Content, including but not limited to numerical latitude or longitude coordinates, imagery, and visible map data;

 

[deltawing777]

Wouldn't it be a violation of the terms and conditions?

http://maps.google.com/help/terms_maps_earth.html

I really dont know. we arent changing anything. just using whats already there.Stream it in thier program a browser, or orbiter. I dont really see the difference.To tell you the truth i dont want this to be a disscussion about whats legal or not but if the capability to incorporate the data (which is public) into orbiter is feasable or not.

 

[insanity]

the data isn't public domain, its got Terms of Service which includes not piping their images and textures into a program they didn't make.

I don't write code, but I'm guessing that this would be a few mountains worth of it. Not only would you have to constantly be grabbing new textures and plotting them out, but you'd have to make it work for something moving at very rapid speeds without making orbiter unplayable.

 

[deltawing777]

the data isn't public domain, its got Terms of Service which includes not piping their images and textures into a program they didn't make.

I don't write code, but I'm guessing that this would be a few mountains worth of it. Not only would you have to constantly be grabbing new textures and plotting them out, but you'd have to make it work for something moving at very rapid speeds without making orbiter unplayable.

Again we can discuss the legalities later.The question is can it be done Technicaly speaking?

 

[garyw]

Again we can discuss the legalities later.The question is can it be done Technicaly speaking?

Yes, it can be done. Anything can be done but you have several hurdles, namely:

• Legalities - no you can't ignore it.
• Bandwidth - Just how much data will be coming down? How will it be cached? Will it be cached? What about time acceleration?
• Format - What format is the data in? How do you convert it and overlay it on the Orbiter world?

 

[deltawing777]

Yes, it can be done. Anything can be done but you have several hurdles, namely:

Legalities - no you can't ignore it.

Bandwidth - Just how much data will be coming down? How will it be cached? Will it be cached? What about time acceleration?

Format - What format is the data in? How do you convert it and overlay it on the Orbiter world?

Now there's the answer I was wanting to hear.And very good points If i may add. Especially the time accel thing. That always seems to be a brick wall/hurdle it seems.And one that I have no answer to. The data I would guess could be compressed/cached in such a way as to not lag the video. Im just guessing here im no coder. So I guess I'll leave this discussion open to "The brains behind the operation" to figure out the technical along with the legalities and ill keep my eye on this discussion from a distance.It was just a thought that since orbiter 2010 has the graphics engine seperate that the possiblity was there to accomplish this goal.Ty GaryW :thumbup:

 

[insane_alien]

you could do procedural generation to get rid of bandwidth/format/legality issues however accuracy would not be guaranteed(however, you can have it arbitrarily detailed depending on processor power)

 

[Artlav]

Technically? Doable.
Orulex came with a World Studio program, which did just that from now-defunct NASA WorldWind servers.
Adapting it to Google data is quite simple.

Bigger problem is making it real-time - it would take significant bandwidth, and non-trivial motion prediction algorithms.

Whatever is to be done, Lua have nothing to do with it.
Either one of my add-ons, or new cjp one would have to be modified in some way to use the data.

 

[deltawing777]

Technically? Doable.
Orulex came with a World Studio program, which did just that from now-defunct NASA WorldWind servers.
Adapting it to Google data is quite simple.

Bigger problem is making it real-time - it would take significant bandwidth, and non-trivial motion prediction algorithms.

Whatever is to be done, Lua have nothing to do with it.
Either one of my add-ons, or new cjp one would have to be modified in some way to use the data.

You the man Artlav! :hail: If anybody can make it happen its you thats for sure!:thumbup:

 

[Hielor]

You the man Artlav! :hail: If anybody can make it happen its you thats for sure!:thumbup:

Have you been ignoring all of the people who've pointed out that this is a violation of the Google Earth terms of use and is thus not going to be done, regardless of how technically feasible it is?

 

[deltawing777]

Have you been ignoring all of the people who've pointed out that this is a violation of the Google Earth terms of use and is thus not going to be done, regardless of how technically feasible it is?

Umm no....and?

 

[garyw]

So your answers are:

Yes. It is technically fesable.

No, it will not be done due to a breach of the terms & conditions of license. Google WILL NOT take kindly to that sort of thing.

 

[deltawing777]

So your answers are:

Yes. It is technically fesable.

No, it will not be done due to a breach of the terms & conditions of license. Google WILL NOT take kindly to that sort of thing.

YES YES YES I get it! I get it! Ok so dont use google use somthing else geeezzzz!!!!!! Im looking at world wind now that artlav was refering to. (yes i know its defunct) Like i said im no coder, I have no answers. USGS? some other server data? So far all Im hearing is why it CANT be done. How about some positive of how it CAN be done.How would you do it?

---------- Post added at 03:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:52 PM ----------

Have you been ignoring all of the people who've pointed out that this is a violation of the Google Earth terms of use and is thus not going to be done, regardless of how technically feasible it is?

How would you do it? what server data would you use? how would you do it leagally?

 

[garyw]

Why not use an heightmap from SRTM data and feed it to Orulex?

 

[cjp]

I have very detailed plans in this direction, and it is on my TO DO list. Just a few notes:

Because of licensing reasons, Google will not be the default data source. However, I will enable users to configure arbitrary map sources by means of editing / overwriting a configuration file. I've had a look at how Google maps tiles are encoded, and it should be no problem at all, as soon as you are legally allowed, to set Google as the data source.

I will probably allow users to configure how much tile cache should be stored on the local hard disk. This setting may also be relevant for your agreement with your map provider. In the case of Google, there seem to be two sides: on one hand, their license does not allow 'mass downloads', probably due to the fear that someone might download an entire copy of the map. A system with a large cache could be interpreted as a mass download system. On the other hand, people have reported being blocked from the Google maps servers after experimenting with high-traffic map applications. This is understandable, as bandwidth has a certain cost for Google, but the best way to reduce bandwidth usage is to have a large cache. So I'm not sure what Google prefers.

I'm not going to ask Google anything, because I have nothing to do with Google. I'm going to make sure that my software can be used with at least one free map provider, and I'll leave it to others, if they wish to use an alternative map source (such as Google), to get permission for that.