Thrust-assisted fast orbit

[dougkeenan]

Welcome Erupter!

 

[Linguofreak]

Very interesting discussion indeed!

I have a question for Linguofreak who seams well informed in the argument: if all you say is true, how do tokamak reactors effectively contain their plasma?

They don't operate at anywhere *near* the power levels that are being talked about here. (In fact, at the moment they take more power to run than they are actually able to produce as electricity). What makes a "Magical Fusion Torch" magical is not so much the fact that it uses fusion as the fact that such a small device puts out so much power without melting itself.

 

[Erupter]

Welcome Erupter!

Thanks :lol:
I really am kind of an oldie of orbiter, but i lost interest some time ago (2006 maybe?) and now i may be back. Who knows...

They don't operate at anywhere *near* the power levels that are being talked about here. (In fact, at the moment they take more power to run than they are actually able to produce as electricity). What makes a "Magical Fusion Torch" magical is not so much the fact that it uses fusion as the fact that such a small device puts out so much power without melting itself.

Yes that's absolutely true, in fact much (if not all) of the systems in this universe can be described by a negative parabolic function in relation to efficiency: how much output the systems yelds for a given input (balance in energy).
Now usually the point of such curves at which we are able to operate systems, depends on technology level and thus era. For now we are not able to push fusion systems beyond the self-sustainment point.
But as well as advancement in fusion technology itself, other areas are being studied as well.
Researches already dimostrated decades ago variations in gravity on small objects in strange situations (like high rotation speed), so why not imagine development in superconductors and electro-mobility and density such that magnetic fields powerful enough can be estabilished?

Neutron, hydrogen, atomic bombs would have appeared very far fetched this year last century, but look where we are. Already we have magnetic acceleration guns (rail-guns) able to achieve thousands of gs (immense power discharge, i have seen something but i don't remember the numbers... a fair amount of joules of impulse though), the LHC is researching particles as well as containment technology so... why not?

Sure some things may be too far fetched: i am not into those numbers, but (i am an electronics engineer) if you tell me we will be able to make transistors below the atomic level... i would never buy it. So sure there are impossible things, but some times "impossible" is just current ignorance
Waiting for the right time to be enlighted.

Edit:
thinking of it, probably until Diesel figured out the right geometric proportions, weights and other details, not even the internal combustion engine did work... Right now we are figuring out how to push the fusion just those few inches above the hill, so that it sits on top by itself. I've read of an interesting discussion about the diverging views of scientists favouring two different approaches to fusion. Some said the approved projects are too long-timed and expansive and won't provide results until about 2050, while other projects (apparently not favoured enough by lobbies or political parties or whatever) would have been much more economic and realizable in a shorter timelines.

Ok after a breaf search this constrast i talked about should have been between IEC (inertial electrostatic confinement) supporters, and those backing standard magnetic confinement.
Obviously currently winners are the latters.

 

[Calsir]

Are there any add-on craft or modified autopilot abilities that allow for this?

Specifically, I want to obtain a circular LEO with a velocity higher than the Earth's gravity alone will allow by using thrust towards the Earth's center to assist in the acceleration required.

Why use a fast orbit in LEO when a slow orbit can do the same job? You would not get as much gravity (about .91g) but at least the ship would not find herself on escape orbit in case of engine failure. Also, you can use the level horizon autopilot that would allow you to use hover thrusters to do the job.

Of course, all the objections posted by Linguofreak about the improbable power plant and thrusters still stand. And you would have huge problems with EPA (or WWF) about the probably toxic and radioactive exhausts that would pollute our lovely (and only) planet.

edit: of course, with Isp greater than 4e3 seconds (default DGiv, IIRC) any spacecraft taking off or landing is likely to be a top tier polluter .