Updates Ares Updates and Discussion

[movieman]

But the key is how different the 5-segment will behave at the same data points (for lack of a better term) as this 4-segment thing.

Exactly: with a 4-segment SRB rather than a 5-segment SRB you'll learn essentially nothing about how an Ares-1 would fly.

We know we can launch spam-cans into space, because we've been doing it for decades. The question is whether the Orion spam-can can be launched safely on the Ares-1 firework... and testing a fake spam-can on top of a different firework won't tell you much.

 

[C3PO]

The question is whether the Orion spam-can can be launched safely on the Ares-1 firework... and testing a fake spam-can on top of a different firework won't tell you much.

Yes it will. You take the measurement from Ares-1X and add a lethal vibration! :lol:

What if NASA dropped the problematic 5-segment SRB, and used a 4-segment with lift-off boosters to make up the DV? Has this configuration been considered?

That's a "No" then.

 

[Andy44]

Reading that article, it sounds like the staff is pretty demoralized and uncertain about the future. Probably getting their resumes up to snuff...

 

[Eagle]

Reading that article, it sounds like the staff is pretty demoralized and uncertain about the future. Probably getting their resumes up to snuff...

Well if things do head down that direction at least there are several active private space companies that they might be happy to work at.

We're going back to the moon, but the writing on the side of the next lander is the unknown.

 

[Moonwalker]

Reading that article, it sounds like the staff is pretty demoralized and uncertain about the future. Probably getting their resumes up to snuff...

Well, how would you sound in case you would work on a project that suffers from low budget?

 

[Andy44]

Well, how would you sound in case you would work on a project that suffers from low budget?

Well, I have worked on contracts (in a different business) that suffer from low budgets. One of them got canceled out from under me and left me scrambling for a new job a few years back.

Part of working in the techie world is that you have to realize that finding the next job is part of the current job, no matter how secure you think you are.

And if nothing else works out, Burger King is always looking for a new Chief Whopper Flopper.

If I were an engineer on the Ares program I would be working hard but keeping an eye on the job market. In general, in the US aerospace industry, NASA contracts are considered less desirable and secure than Pentagon contracts.

 

[tblaxland]

Well, how would you sound in case you would work on a project that suffers from low budget?

I've never worked on any other kind of project, ie, where requirements > budget. Whenever I've found myself thinking otherwise, it only turn out to be an illusion (or delusion). Ultimately, either the requirements or the budget, or both, end up moving.

 

[C3PO]

I've never worked on any other kind of project, ie, where requirements > budget. Whenever I've found myself thinking otherwise, it only turn out to be an illusion (or delusion). Ultimately, either the requirements or the budget, or both, end up moving.

:hesaid:

Is it only me, or does anyone else sense a bit of back-pedaling concerning the Ares programmes? Or is it a way to try to get more funding?
You never see anyone that "looks" 100% convinced that Ares is going to make it to the moon. All interviews are full of "if"s.
Or maybe I'm just old fashioned. :lol:
You wouldn't see this kind of leadership during the 60's and early 70's. Well, maybe it's a good thing.

 

[Brad]

What I think is happening is that NASA is trying to send a message to Congress that if it doesn't get the funding, and soon, that everything is going to stop - as far as manned spaceflight is concerned, when the last STS mission goes up in September 2010.

Either you fund it or not, but make up your mind.

 

[Andy44]

Or just procrastinate. Which is the same thing as saying "no".

 

[Moonwalker]

What I think is happening is that NASA is trying to send a message to Congress that if it doesn't get the funding, and soon, that everything is going to stop - as far as manned spaceflight is concerned, when the last STS mission goes up in September 2010.

Not only NASA is trying to send such a message. On September 16th, Augustine said that extending the Shuttle flights will cause delays on Ares. He even said that with proper funding Constellation is a practicable space program. And even more: he clearly emphasized that Ares1-X should lift off in any case, as it will provide important knowledge, even if Ares1 would not fly in future. But I guess certain people, who think to know it all better, now start to argue that he is just jumping on the Ares1-X show and that his lack of engineering sense is astounding.

It seems that Constellation has a much stronger support than one might think. And they did not yet say anything about mismanagement...

 

[tblaxland]

But I guess certain people, who think to know it all better, now start to argue that he is just jumping on the Ares1-X show and that his lack of engineering sense is astounding.

No, he is showing wisdom in recognising that Ares 1-X is what it now is and that it would be throwing good money after bad to try and change it now. What I, and others, have been arguing is that Ares 1-X should have been baselined as a 5-segment test from the start. I have no doubt that Ares 1-X will provide "important knowledge", but will it be as valuable as it could have been?

 

[Ark]

What I think is happening is that NASA is trying to send a message to Congress that if it doesn't get the funding, and soon, that everything is going to stop - as far as manned spaceflight is concerned, when the last STS mission goes up in September 2010.

Either you fund it or not, but make up your mind.

Considering the amount of money that Congress has shelled out to people screaming "We need money now or it's gonna hit the fan!", trying tactics like that may just get them axed altogether. I'm sure there's still Air Force guys who'd like to soak up NASA's funding and shell it out to some defense contractors.

 

[Andy44]

What I, and others, have been arguing is that Ares 1-X should have been baselined as a 5-segment test from the start.

Right on the nose.

 

[John_L]

:hesaid:

Is it only me, or does anyone else sense a bit of back-pedaling concerning the Ares programmes? Or is it a way to try to get more funding?
You never see anyone that "looks" 100% convinced that Ares is going to make it to the moon. All interviews are full of "if"s.
Or maybe I'm just old fashioned. :lol:
You wouldn't see this kind of leadership during the 60's and early 70's. Well, maybe it's a good thing.

There's a democrat in office, democrats always cut back on NASA. I warned everyone about this, but they were all too busy bashing Bush or couldn't see thru the glare of the anointed one. Think twice before voting for a far left socialist.

 

[tl8]

I don't think there have been any cutbacks, in fact wasn't $1 billion given to NASA as a part of the stimulus package?

However NASA have run-out of money to keep doing what they are doing. That is, their budget has not increased enough to complete Ares.

 

[ahahnapex]

NASA is critical for the US

For those interested, the DM-1 test at the ATK test site in Utah is today. I'll be there in person to watch it, however NASA TV is also going to cover it.

The ground test will be covered live starting around 12:50 p.m. MDT via NASA's education channel at www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/index.html (click on the "Education Channel" link on the right side of the page. The test is suppose to start at 1:15 p.m.

Keeping my fingers crossed for a good test.

My brilliant brother is an engineer in Huntsville on the Orion project. I watched the test streaming on the link you posted next day. AMAZING. I was supposed to be there Oct. 31 to hang with the NASA guys and watch the launch. But they had to go and move it up to a Tuesday. Can't work around that. My brother has all confidence in the design. And he's pretty darn smart.

 

[ahahnapex]

I don't think there have been any cutbacks, in fact wasn't $1 billion given to NASA as a part of the stimulus package?

However NASA have run-out of money to keep doing what they are doing. That is, their budget has not increased enough to complete Ares.

I could be wrong... But I don't think NASA got any additional funding, from the stimulus bill or otherwise. My brother is an engineer on Orion. In fact working on the vibration issues. They are severely underfunded. But yet he remains completely optimistic.

 

[tblaxland]

There's a democrat in office, democrats always cut back on NASA. I warned everyone about this, but they were all too busy bashing Bush or couldn't see thru the glare of the anointed one. Think twice before voting for a far left socialist.

You got me thinking so I thought I'd crunch the numbers. As you can see your statement is not supported by the facts. I don't really care about the politics and I don't really care to get into an argument about Democrats vs Republicans (I don't even live there), but you should be careful when making such sweeping generalisations.

I don't think there have been any cutbacks, in fact wasn't $1 billion given to NASA as a part of the stimulus package?

Yes. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Recovery_and_Reinvestment_Act#Scientific_research

 

[eveningsky339]

*watches an Atlas V launch on youtube*

*wonders how hard it would be to put an Orion on top*

---------- Post added at 08:38 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:31 AM ----------

You got me thinking so I thought I'd crunch the numbers. As you can see your statement is not supported by the facts. I don't really care about the politics and I don't really care to get into an argument about Democrats vs Republicans (I don't even live there), but you should be careful when making such sweeping generalisations.

Yes. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Recovery_and_Reinvestment_Act#Scientific_research

It's nice to have some hard data here, but let's not forget some lurking variables-- the Cold War, personal preferences of each president, etc.