Project D3D11Client Development

dumbo2007

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but it will be up to vessel devs to model/use SDK

OOH YEAH baby !!! :) :) ....

Once I get my head around this scene graph working for the next release of Bump , then its time to hit the texturing tools.

I have always wondered whether its possible to do as many lights as in the scenes above, with reasonable frame rates. Anyone have any idea about that ?
 
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asmi

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I have always wondered whether its possible to do as many lights as in the scenes above, with reasonable frame rates. Anyone have any idea about that ?
It's hard to say since there are many variables - what kind of hardware we're talking about, what FPS is considered "reasonable", geometry complexity, and the list goes on and on...
 

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super quality interiors of ships would be nice. Something to throw at the SSU guys. Come up with a PMDG NGX level of VC. Epic. Would take a serious machine to run. CPU and GPU wise.
 

asmi

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super quality interiors of ships would be nice. Something to throw at the SSU guys. Come up with a PMDG NGX level of VC. Epic. Would take a serious machine to run.
The quality would depend mostly on whoever will be designing/texturing the scene, not so much on engine itself...
CPU and GPU wise.
Nope, in D3D11Client CPU is mostly at rest, the GPU is a critical element - and more complex the scene is, more that statement is true. And that is like that on purpose - modern GPU's got hundreds (if not thousands) of processing cores, while CPU's cores count still sits in the single digit...
 

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How is the framerate ?
Nope, in D3D11Client CPU is mostly at rest, the GPU is a critical element - and more complex the scene is, more that statement is true.
Yes, it is so true that even my very old E5200 (overclocked to 3.5 ghz though) can load my new 7850 (with 1024 processing cores) at 99 %, so worst fps in 1600x900 is about ~370 with L11 diffuse, L11 specular, L11 normal, L13 height, L13 land cover Earth textures, terrain, new atmosphere and without HDR and 170 with HDR :) (8800gt had 120 and 25) this client doesn't compute anything big on CPU so good video card is enough to have good fps. fps may be increased in future because the client's code may be optimized further. :)

So I guess the header for declaring the functions used to get the altitude at any place is still present ?
Yes, I already tried to get altitude at any place and it worked with precision about centimeters.
 
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Frogisis

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I just tried it again, and it's looking great (esp. the normal maps on the moon. whoa.), but I'm still having weird issues with the post-processing, even with the latest version of the client and the latest drivers for my card (GTX 570, Win7). I've tried all sorts of combinations of settings in both the DX11 video options and nVidia controls, but the brightness level fluctuates rapidly at all time accelerations, and in the external view it just gets brighter and brighter over about a minute until everything is covered by eye-searing glare, no matter how far I am from the sun. If I switch to the internal view it goes back to normal, but the fluctuations remain and for me are too distracting to be playable with the effects on.
Its behavior makes it so I can't tell exactly what the post processing effects are supposed to be doing - Right now if I'm in the shadow of a planet it makes the stars and moons brighter like you'd expect, but in the daylight if I look at the sun it quickly turns into a solid white circle and all the stars increase to identical maximum brightness. I assume they're supposed to be washed out to solid black when everything else gets brighter, but maybe you guys just haven't gotten around to that yet. The horizon glow looks amazing and soft, but the sun and stars seem to get too "sharp," I think - At least if my effects are doing what they're supposed to.

Another thing, though it's probably been mentioned before, is that the exhaust graphics don't seem to be able to change intensity depending on thrust level, but are always at maximum. When using a hold autopilot, it looks like the RCS is going crazy, and even a little thrust from the main or hover engines causes them to appear at full blast. It did help me discover why my joystick seemed to be always jittering when on the ground, though, since I could clearly see where I'd forgotten to add a deadzone.

I'm also getting the weird colors on buildings, but they seem to go away if I zoom way out then zoom back in, or if I just go into the shutdown options in the lauchpad and select "terminate Orbiter process" and start fresh each time.

It looks so great, though, and I love the soft glows and illumination from the lights - It makes everything feel so much more real. I do think in both DX clients the clouds look a little flat and low-res compared to the stock graphics, but that's probably a function of the shadows being lighter overall so the microtextures don't pop the same way. I tried messing with the .fx files for the cloud shadows but my understanding of that code is approximately zero, so I didn't get anywhere.
 

dumbo2007

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Yes, I already tried to get altitude at any place and it worked with precision about centimeters.

Awesomeness !!


I am keeping a sharp lookout on this forum now :shifty:
 

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Seems there is awesome work there ! Congrats ! :thumbup:
 

dumbo2007

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So is it possible to turn on/off post processing effects in game ? A lot of games provide in game controls, and SDK interface functions, so that certain effects can be turned on for certain scenes only.
 

asmi

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I just tried it again, and it's looking great (esp. the normal maps on the moon. whoa.), but I'm still having weird issues with the post-processing, even with the latest version of the client and the latest drivers for my card (GTX 570, Win7). I've tried all sorts of combinations of settings in both the DX11 video options and nVidia controls, but the brightness level fluctuates rapidly at all time accelerations, and in the external view it just gets brighter and brighter over about a minute until everything is covered by eye-searing glare, no matter how far I am from the sun. If I switch to the internal view it goes back to normal, but the fluctuations remain and for me are too distracting to be playable with the effects on.
Thanks for your message, I've just discovered a bug in code and fixed that. So I'd really appreciate if you could get latest version and try it again.

It looks so great, though, and I love the soft glows and illumination from the lights - It makes everything feel so much more real. I do think in both DX clients the clouds look a little flat and low-res compared to the stock graphics, but that's probably a function of the shadows being lighter overall so the microtextures don't pop the same way. I tried messing with the .fx files for the cloud shadows but my understanding of that code is approximately zero, so I didn't get anywhere.
Yes, the clouds and particle effects are on my workbook - so I will get them fixed once we'll finish with current things.

So is it possible to turn on/off post processing effects in game ? A lot of games provide in game controls, and SDK interface functions, so that certain effects can be turned on for certain scenes only.
Yes, there is a checkbox in settings to enable/disable HDR effects.

---------- Post added at 22:07 ---------- Previous post was at 21:31 ----------

UPDATE:

I've fixed bug with exhaust transparency. Now it works just the way it's supposed to. Please download latest & check it out.

P.S. Looks like I'm in a mood for some "good old bugs" fixing :lol:

---------- Post added Apr 29th, 2012 at 00:21 ---------- Previous post was Apr 28th, 2012 at 22:07 ----------

While bug-hunting, I've encountered a couple things that might be of interest.
Code:
[I];Non-Directory Base Bug ([planet name].cfg)[/I]

it looks like it thinks it loaded correctly
I know it took a long time :tiphat:, but today I've fixed that bug - now "inline" bases are also being read from planet config file.
 

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And as I was testing all of aforementioned fixes, I've snapped this screenshot - I really liked the view, so I couldn't abstain from sharing it with you :)
Here it is - it's Soyuz FG booster with Soyuz TMA on top of it heading towards orbit - currently first stage(or strap-on) boosters had already been separated.
Soyuz ascent.jpg
 

Frogisis

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---------- Post added at 22:07 ---------- Previous post was at 21:31 ----------

UPDATE:

I've fixed bug with exhaust transparency. Now it works just the way it's supposed to. Please download latest & check it out.

That did it! Now the exhaust looks like it always has.



---------- Post added Apr 29th, 2012 at 00:21 ---------- Previous post was Apr 28th, 2012 at 22:07 ----------


I know it took a long time :tiphat:, but today I've fixed that bug - now "inline" bases are also being read from planet config file.

Oh noooo - This one makes it crash on startup without any hint in the log, even if I disable all the modules - it just says "Orbiter has stopped working". I replaced the DX11client.dll in "plugins" with the previous one and now it works fine again.

The changes you made helped with the post-processing, but really only toned it down - it's less likely to immediately jump to blinding brightness but still jitters quite a bit, though sometimes it settles on what I assume is the intended value and just flickers like a poorly wired dimmer switch, and now looking away from something bright like the horizon in LEO or the sun or stars i.e. straight towards the ground will cause it to dim back down. Rotating the view also seems to pause or slightly reverse the increase a little.
It seems to have something to do with the way meshes are rendered in the external view, leading to some kind of feedback. It still happens even with all the effects turned off in the launchpad, as long as you're in the external view and a mesh is being drawn. Here's a list of things I noticed that might help narrow it down:
- In the cockpit view it quickly wobbles down to a steady, solid level that's actually duller and darker than the unprocessed effects. This seems to be the "default" level it wants to rest at, but it's much duller than the shots you posted. It looks like a vaseline filter instead of light, but it's the only time it doesn't flicker, except in a VC, where it's subtle because the outside is still at the solid, darkest level.
- In the external view, if you zoom out till the mesh is just a dot, it dims to the stable bottom level.
- Even in the cockpit view, having another mesh onscreen will cause another brightness explosion, but more complicated or numerous meshes kept it from reaching the same extreme levels.
- The only exception I noticed in the external view turned out to be because the brightness had invisibly latched onto the VC of the XR2, and when I switched back into it, I saw it glowing white then dim back down.

That's all I was able to figure out, hopefully it's helpful.
You've probably seen this already, too, but something else I noticed with the post processing are these aliased little sparkles around a planet with an atmosphere when seen from far away, like this:
Rtx0x.jpg


Awesome to hear you're working on new clouds, too - That's been something we've needed for a while.
 
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asmi

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Oh noooo - This one makes it crash on startup without any hint in the log, even if I disable all the modules - it just says "Orbiter has stopped working". I replaced the DX11client.dll in "plugins" with the previous one and now it works fine again.
Oooops, sorry about that :( Now it should work - please check that.

The changes you made helped with the post-processing, but really only toned it down - it's less likely to immediately jump to blinding brightness but still jitters quite a bit, though sometimes it settles on what I assume is the intended value and just flickers like a poorly wired dimmer switch, and now looking away from something bright like the horizon in LEO or the sun or stars i.e. straight towards the ground will cause it to dim back down. Rotating the view also seems to pause or slightly reverse the increase a little.
It seems to have something to do with the way meshes are rendered in the external view, leading to some kind of feedback. It still happens even with all the effects turned off in the launchpad, as long as you're in the external view and a mesh is being drawn. Here's a list of things I noticed that might help narrow it down:
- In the cockpit view it quickly wobbles down to a steady, solid level that's actually duller and darker than the unprocessed effects. This seems to be the "default" level it wants to rest at, but it's much duller than the shots you posted. It looks like a vaseline filter instead of light, but it's the only time it doesn't flicker, except in a VC, where it's subtle because the outside is still at the solid, darkest level.
- In the external view, if you zoom out till the mesh is just a dot, it dims to the stable bottom level.
- Even in the cockpit view, having another mesh onscreen will cause another brightness explosion, but more complicated or numerous meshes kept it from reaching the same extreme levels.
- The only exception I noticed in the external view turned out to be because the brightness had invisibly latched onto the VC of the XR2, and when I switched back into it, I saw it glowing white then dim back down.
Can you please record small video showing what's going on?
That's all I was able to figure out, hopefully it's helpful.
You've probably seen this already, too, but something else I noticed with the post processing are these aliased little sparkles around a planet with an atmosphere when seen from far away, like this:
Rtx0x.jpg
This is not happening in a new version of atmosphere rendering, so it's gonna stay that way until we release new version.
Awesome to hear you're working on new clouds, too - That's been something we've needed for a while.
I'm not working on it right now, but there are plans for that :)
 

Frogisis

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Awesome, that update did the trick and it works just fine now.
Can't wait to see the new atmosphere effects, too.

Here's a little video showing what I'm talking about. Fraps didn't capture the lighting wobbles in the VC hud glass very well, but you can make them out a little:
 

asmi

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Awesome, that update did the trick and it works just fine now.
Can't wait to see the new atmosphere effects, too.

Here's a little video showing what I'm talking about. Fraps didn't capture the lighting wobbles in the VC hud glass very well, but you can make them out a little:
Orbiter DX11 Client Post Processing Issues - YouTube

I see what you mean now. What hardware you've got? I looked through the code and wan't able to find what could cause the issue, but I will keep looking.
 

Cras

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I am not home with my main machine, which would find this bug. It seems to be able to find any kinks.

But I do have my laptop, and I think it is Dx11 capable. Either way, I will download the latest version and give it a try as soon as I can.
 

dumbo2007

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I was looking at this question : http://orbiter-forum.com/showthread.php?t=27213

and wondering, is it possible to render to texture in every frame or say every 3 frames and still have reasonable fps with the client ?

That would help show camera views in real time in mfds just like camera mfd(which has a lag)
 

asmi

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I was looking at this question : http://orbiter-forum.com/showthread.php?t=27213

and wondering, is it possible to render to texture in every frame or say every 3 frames and still have reasonable fps with the client ?

That would help show camera views in real time in mfds just like camera mfd(which has a lag)
Well, common sence tells me that if you've gotta draw everything twice, the FPS will be somewhere like half of what it is now :lol:
 
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