News ESA's Future: The News and Updates Thread

[Pipcard]

The ESA is considering another version of the Ariane 6 still with all solid lower stages:

L’Europe s’élance vers Ariane 6.
http://www.cnes.fr/web/CNES-fr/10692-gp-l-europe-s-elance-vers-ariane-6.php [in French]


Bob Clark

The look of the 2-booster bottom stage looks awkward.

 

[Cosmic Penguin]

The look of the 2-booster bottom stage looks awkward.

I was actually trying to sell a similar idea to the Italian Orbiter add-on developers as a replacement of the Neptune-1 series. After all their rockets require expensive large thrust engines on the second stage because the P241 can only go that long. While I have a dislike on the PPH concept, I think the use of the same solid motors on the first and second stages would decrease its costs. Plus they are Italian...... :thumbup:

 

[RGClark]

The ESA is considering another version of the Ariane 6 still with all solid lower stages:

L’Europe s’élance vers Ariane 6.
http://www.cnes.fr/web/CNES-fr/10692-gp-l-europe-s-elance-vers-ariane-6.php [in French]

English language version:

Europe sets its sights on Ariane 6.
http://www.cnes.fr/web/CNES-en/10705-gp-europe-sets-its-sights-on-ariane-6.php

Bob Clark

 

[Pipcard]

The Russians are currently the main competitors with their Proton launcher, Ukraine’s Zenit vehicle is operational again—albeit after a series of setbacks—and China’s Long March could be a new entrant by 2020... All these factors are likely to erode Ariane’s market share.

Notice how SpaceX wasn't mentioned.

 

[orb]

ESA: Latvia becomes seventh ESA European Cooperating State

 

[orb]

Space News: France Favors CNES with Better-than-inflation Budget Bump:

BEIJING — The French Research Ministry on Sept. 26 said the French civil space budget in 2014 would slightly outpace the current low inflation rate, with a big increase in spending via the European Space Agency (ESA) offset by a decrease in France’s non-ESA-related programs.

Presenting France’s overall 2014 research budget, the ministry said French spending at the 20-nation ESA would grow by 7.8 percent in 2014, to 854.4 million euros ($1.1 billion), to meet French commitments to begin work on a next-generation Ariane 6 rocket.

The overall budget for the French space agency, CNES, for 2014 is increasing by 1.3 percent over 2013, the ministry said, to 1.43 billion euros. France’s budget is generally divided into ESA programs and programs managed by CNES outside ESA, either as French national efforts or with other partners.

{...}

 

[N_Molson]

That precious money going to Ariane 6... Arg...

 

[Unstung]

European proposals for two future Large missions (€1 billion each) includes spacecraft that will study most, if not all, of the planets in the solar system. Considering JUICE will study the Jovian system and BepiColombo will visit Mercury, those two planets are already covered. However, any selected mission for the L2 and L3 spots won't launch for a long time, in 2028 and 2034 respectively. There should be more astrophysics proposals relative to planetary missions but the article doesn't list any observatories other than exoplanet hunters.

The Planetary Society: "Europe Will Select Its Next Major Science Mission in November"

Last spring, the European Space Agency (ESA) put out a call for concepts for its next two €1-billion science missions. If history proves to be a guide, there's a good chance that one of the selected concepts will be a solar system mission. ESA's managers will announce their selection this coming November.

These large European missions are particularly important because they have the resources both to reach targets throughout the solar system and to carry enough instruments to conduct wide ranging studies once there. If one of the solar system concepts is selected, we may get our first orbiter for Uranus, a return to Titan, or an orbiter and balloon for Venus. The range of concepts proposed shows that planetary exploration continues to have a wealth of possible missions.

However, don't hold your breath. ESA believes in long term planning and the launches of the selected missions are planned for 2028 and 2034. Add in ten to sixteen years for, say, a flight to Uranus, and you may be looking at first science return in the 2040s or 2050s. (Actuarial tables suggest I won't be around then, so for purely selfish reasons, I like the concepts with much shorter flight times, like those to Venus.)
[...]

 

[orb]

EADS Astrium: Astrium awarded three new contracts by ESA for Ariane 6 and Ariane 5 ME launchers

 

[orb]

Space News:

• Entry Fees for New ESA Members Go to ExoMars
  
  
• 'Competition Card' Draws 150 Proposals for Ariane 6 Development

 

[RGClark]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZ06r9aWhfg

Thanks for that. Pretty cool.

Bob Clark

 

[orb]

Space News: Dordain: ESA Pact Doesn’t Rule Out Defense Work:

PARIS — The director-general of the European Space Agency (ESA), rejecting a criticism leveled by the European Commission, said the agency’s convention referring to “peaceful uses only” no more limits ESA’s ability to conduct military space activities than the United Nations Outer Space Treaty constrains that treaty’s signatories, which include the United States and Russia.

Jean-Jacques Dordain, in testimony to the U.K. Parliament’s Science and Technology Committee, said the 20-nation agency is capable of performing defense and security work for the European Commission or other European governments without changing its convention or its membership.

{...}

 

[orb]

Space News: European Space Agency, OHB Blamed for Galileo Delays; Financial Penalties Forthcoming

 

[Notebook]

Ariane 6 moves to next stage of development
11 November 2013
The preliminary requirements for Europe’s next-generation Ariane 6 launcher have been agreed and the project is set to move on to the next stage.

In November 2012, the ESA Council at Ministerial level, meeting in Naples, Italy, approved the start of preparatory activities for Europe’s next-generation Ariane 6 launch vehicle.

http://www.esa.int/Our_Activities/Launchers/Ariane_6_moves_to_next_stage_of_development

 

[Urwumpe]

Solid first and second stages...Looks like France got their chance to develop their new ICBMs with ESA money. When will the USA declare embargo against Europe?

And is somebody developing it for Orbiter? The video is really a bit poor compared to what we do in real-time here.

 

[RGClark]

http://www.esa.int/Our_Activities/Launchers/Ariane_6_moves_to_next_stage_of_development

By deciding on the solid-fueled Ariane 6, ESA is, unwittingly, betting on SpaceX to fail on reusability. For if SpaceX succeeds then the solid-fueled Ariane 6 becomes obsolete, with billions of dollars and years wasted. ESA would then have to start all over again to develop a liquid-fueled version which can be made reusable.

Musk lays out plans for reusability of the Falcon 9 rocket.
October 3, 2013 by Yves-A. Grondin

“The most important thing is that we now believe we have all the pieces of the puzzle (for recovery). If you take the Grasshopper tests, where we were able to do a precision takeoff and landing of a Falcon 9 first stage and you combine it with the results from this flight where we were able to successfully transition from vacuum to hypersonic, through supersonic, through transonic and light the engines all the way through and control the stage all the way through.
“We have all the pieces necessary to achieve a full recovery of the boost stage.”
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2013/10/musk-plans-reusability-falcon-9-rocket/

I think it's a bad bet on ESA's part.

Bob Clark

 

[Urwumpe]

For if SpaceX succeeds then the solid-fueled Ariane 6 becomes obsolete, with billions of dollars and years wasted. ESA would then have to start all over again to develop a liquid-fueled version which can be made reusable.

How much are you willed to bet yourself on SpaceX managing to even get a two-digit market share on the geostationary market?

Also, a statement by SpaceX from SpaceX best fanboy in a ESA thread is pretty funny, since the test on the Falcon 9 1.1 launch failed exactly because of the pieces that they did not have: Everything that they did not test on Grasshopper went wrong.

 

[Einion Yrth]

How much are you willed to bet yourself on SpaceX managing to even get a two-digit market share on the geostationary market?
​

Are you offering to cover such a bet?

 

[Urwumpe]

Are you offering to cover such a bet?

Sure. Because I don't see SpaceX getting far yet - and the problem is not the technology, which could be solved easily.

 

[orb]

O-F Staff Note:

11 posts discussing whether Falcon 9 1.1 1st stage's hypersonic reentry on its 1st flight was a success towards its reusability have been moved to "[Discussion] Falcon 9 1.1 1st stage hypersonic reentry" thread.

Please keep the discussion on-topic. This thread is about ESA's future and not about SpaceX projects or feasibility.​

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