Request AI System for Orbiter

[TCR_500]

Is there actually an AI system for orbiter in progress or released? And if there is, where do I find it (or the Beta Version)? I couldn't find anything in the search results.

 

[Artlav]

Define "AI system".
There are add-ons that do:
-asteroid fields
-satellite traffic
-scripted missions
-formation flying bots after player
-multiplayer mission control

 

[ar81]

If you mean air traffic, you may create playbacks for vessels and put them all together and then add a new vessel to the scenario so you will see lots of prerecorded movement.

If it is about autopilots, you have RendezvousMFD, AutoFCS, etc...

If it is about scripting system, Martin is working on Lua scripting for the next version of Orbiter.

 

[TCR_500]

Ok, scene I've just done mostly racing on simulators, AI only meant one thing. Artificial Intelligence. Or, computer controlled traffic on a predetermined path. Usually, this path is written by doing a private testing session and using the car to draw a line for the AI cars to follow. And other lines will indicate the maximum variance from the main line. By adding multiple "main lines", an AI vehicle will go on either one line or another depending on circumstances at the moment.

Sorry if I wasn't clear. I didn't know that AI had several meanings in Orbiter.

 

[Kaito]

Yup, still have no clue what you're trying to say.
I think what you mean is the playback feature. You can "pre-record" flight movements, and they will follow them, but thats as far as you can go currently.

 

[RisingFury]

Yup, still have no clue what you're trying to say.
I think what you mean is the playback feature. You can "pre-record" flight movements, and they will follow them, but thats as far as you can go currently.

No, he wants ships in orbiter that will fly themselves to Orbit, go to the Moon, come back and land at a different base, refuel and do it all over again.

 

[garyw]

Ok, scene I've just done mostly racing on simulators, AI only meant one thing. Artificial Intelligence. Or, computer controlled traffic on a predetermined path. Usually, this path is written by doing a private testing session and using the car to draw a line for the AI cars to follow. And other lines will indicate the maximum variance from the main line. By adding multiple "main lines", an AI vehicle will go on either one line or another depending on circumstances at the moment.

Sorry if I wasn't clear. I didn't know that AI had several meanings in Orbiter.

Computer controlled traffic on a predetermined path is NOT AI, Artificial intelligence would not use a predetermined path - what's the point of that? Where is the intelligence?

and please spell SINCE correctly. It's getting irritating!

 

[TCR_500]

The intelligence is what the vehicle does in certain situations. The AI vehicles are allowed to deviate from the line in those situations. In the racing simulators like NR2003 and rFactor, the AI will deviate from the "defined" racing line to try to pass another car, to let a faster car past, or to avoid making contact with another car. The AI will also change lines if they need to re-fuel, change tire, or make repairs. The "pre-recorded" path is only used in certain conditions. If the conditions aren't right, the AI will deviate from that path.

 

[garyw]

Still not AI as they are responding to very simple conditions - if x=TRUE do Y.

There is no intelligence in that.

For there to be true AI you need to start looking at neural networks

 

[ar81]

Well, if a FlockMFD was invented, that would be kind of AI...
Or an Orbiter atmospheric combat MFD using bullets...

 

[DarkWanderer]

I'd better propose someone to look into possbilities of developing a multiplayer plugin. The OMP seems to have got entangled in it's own complexity.

 

[ar81]

I'd better propose someone to look into possbilities of developing a multiplayer plugin. The OMP seems to have got entangled in it's own complexity.

Are you suggesting remotely generated AI?
Chair to keyboard AI procedures?
:lol::rofl:

 

[DarkWanderer]

Of course. This AI will be not perfect, but a good point to start

 

[Face]

I'd better propose someone to look into possbilities of developing a multiplayer plugin. The OMP seems to have got entangled in it's own complexity.

Well, everyone is welcome to fork the open source project and disentangle the complexity. Either that, or just start over with a really clever and new approach to the multiplayer topic. It can't be so hard, can it?

 

[TCR_500]

Simple, but even a simple condition can get complicated very fast. If you ever watched a NASCAR race, you'll probably notice that each driver uses a different method of avoiding the big one. If you have a racing simulator, like NR2003 or rFactor, the AI cars respond to you and each other and are literally racing and blocking you and each other (depending on your AI settings and how good the programming is). And in Flight Simulator 2004, the conditions are not simple at all. If a runway is in use, the other planes need to stay off of it. And, they do need to maintain a certain distance and stay on the taxiway. Plus, in the air, they need to respond to certain situations as well. You can't land when another plane is using the same runway, and you need to respond to stuff like turbulence so the plane doesn't get tossed around very much. Plus, the AI cars are effected by the same physics as the player controlled car or plane. So the AI vehicles also need to respond to stuff like temperature and wind as well as the draft (racers term for air pockets that are turbulent due to the car punching through the air).

 

[Kaito]

Is there REAL AI In orbiter: No
Is there such as thing as REAL AI: No
Can you make "Game AI", where they do what you are saying: No
Can you make Ships follow a pre-determined path, and not deviate from that path in any way, shape, or form: Yes

There's your answer

 

[TCR_500]

Your third one is wrong. You obviously don't have rFactor or NR2003 which have the best AI. They do respond to each other and the player. They race each other and the player. They do try to avoid contact with other cars and the wall. They are effected by physics. Now they're not perfect, but what do you expect from a bunch of scrap metal that has hundreds of billions of "on/off" switches in the formation of a small disk? And those AI are state of the art for our time. And, your second answer may be right right now, but in the future, they may be wrong.

 

[Hielor]

Your third one is wrong. You obviously don't have rFactor or NR2003 which have the best AI. They do respond to each other and the player. They race each other and the player. They do try to avoid contact with other cars and the wall. They are effected by physics. Now they're not perfect, but what do you expect from a bunch of scrap metal that has hundreds of billions of "on/off" switches in the formation of a small disk? And those AI are state of the art for our time. And, your second answer may be right right now, but in the future, they may be wrong.

No, he's right.

You asked about Orbiter. All of his answers were regarding Orbiter.

 

[Woo482]

TCR I thought you was making your own space flight sim why don't you put AI in to that ?

 

[TCR_500]

Is there such as thing as REAL AI:
Can you make "Game AI", where they do what you are saying:

Those questions were not specific to orbiter. "Game AI" can be any game. And NR2003 has the best of that. Right now, "REAL AI" is not possible, but it may be in the future. Right now, the "Game AI" is the best that we've got. Which technicly isnt real AI, but it's "AI" enogh to do it's job, which is basicly to give you something to interact with.

Online is a good way to challange your skills against others, but if you can't go online or have the disire to go online, the "AI" is good enough. And yes, I would like something easier than OMP. And (seperatly) some sort of anti-cheat system to go with it.

The idea for my simulator was originally disigned for racing motor vehicles like NASCAR Sprint Cup cars or NHRA cars. But the engine is going to be so complex, that it allows for flight. And the AI is probably going to be the biggest hold up. I want them to be able to be given a black flag unlike other simulators which never flag an AI.