Request Spacecraft3 for Celestia

[Motherbrain]

I remember reading a thread about adding spacecraft3 to other space simulations. I was wondering has anybody had any success adding spacecraft3 to Celestia? Can this be done? Has anybody done it? Are their any links?
Can I do it myself by just moving some files? Warping my ship to Neptune can get old at times and Celestia is would easily send me "were no man has gone before" :lol:

I'm sorry if the moment I created my account I started to post like this but I had a lot of questions for my favorite sim but not enough answers!

Thanks.

 

[4throck]

The last time I checked Celestia there was no support for active vessels that the user could control. You can see spacecraft there, but they are the same as any other astronomical object. I think that you can script some animations, but not any interactive control. But I may be mistaken.

 

[Pipcard]

Celestia is an astronomy simulator, not a Newtonian physics spaceflight simulator.

 

[Loru]

The last time I checked Celestia there was no support for active vessels that the user could control. You can see spacecraft there, but they are the same as any other astronomical object. I think that you can script some animations, but not any interactive control. But I may be mistaken.

I've peeked at developer resources for Celestia and found no active vessels tutorial. Model however can be converted from Orbiter's MSH to Celestia's format (3ds for example). A long time ago I replaced ISS model with Imperial Star Destroyer in my Celestia.

 

[Motherbrain]

K-N-O-W, no! :lol:

Ugh ok thanks anyway.

I wish Orbiter had more stars. Maybe someday when we get Orbiter 2014 or something.

 

[Loru]

Afaik last version of Spaceway by Artlav have whole galaxy of stars and supports spacecraft3. However you have to ask him how to include them into Spaceway install. I haven't tried it yet.

 

[Motherbrain]

Yah I already found it and its pretty cool! Heard about its spacecraft3 support. May look into it. I need my dad to teach me had to write code.
A lot of this stuff I need to learn myself. :lol:
Maybe theirs a way to implement Celestia into Orbiter instead of the other way around.
The thing is Orbiter is all built around an epicenter (our sun) and their has to be a way to rebuild it so the center of the program is the galaxy and the stars...ugh I know you guys have heard it all before. :lol:
To me the single system thing is the most frustrating part of Orbiter... I it had more stars the sim would be next to perfect...

 

[jedidia]

I wish Orbiter had more stars. Maybe someday when we get Orbiter 2014 or something.

There's also that thing in my signature until then...

 

[Motherbrain]

Oh you made Orbiter Galaxy! I loved it before I had to reinstall Obiter.
Wont hurt to get it again.
But someday when I learn how to make a program here's what I'm going to do.
Of course its a space simulator, very similar to orbiter.
Full Newtonian physics, no "Star wars" physics no "easy mode".
At least 10'000 stars with complete systems. Planets, moons, asteroids
ground bases, some ground scenery etc.
Permanent space stations with refueling are star craft repairing ability.
Some form of economy, fly cargo from station to station, launch satellites (that stay there forever in the game until you ither destroy them or reclaim them).
Space craft both real and fictional. Space shuttle, Apollo space craft, Star destroyers etc. Some with warping ability, some without.
Multi player capable. Within a SEAMLESS universe.
Free to play.

I know. Typical space sim fan dream game. :lol:
Ah someday...but for know I'll log off before I get banned or something. :lol:

 

[Artlav]

But someday when I learn how to make a program here's what I'm going to do.
Of course its a space simulator, very similar to orbiter.
Full Newtonian physics, no "Star wars" physics no "easy mode".
At least 10'000 stars with complete systems. Planets, moons, asteroids
ground bases, some ground scenery etc.

Ah. One day, 14 years ago, i dreamed of making better Windows. With round and triangular windows!
The days of endless optimism and being absolutely ignorant of what is possible and what isn't.
Enjoy it while it lasts.

 

[garyw]

Many people have made the same claim as to building the next iteration of orbiter.

Here are two such threads that have gone nowhere:

http://orbiter-forum.com/showthread.php?t=19542
http://orbiter-forum.com/showthread.php?p=341950&postcount=11

I'm only aware of two people that have actually put something out there.

jedidia with orbiter galaxy
and artlav with spaceway

Of course, there is Face who has done a fine job with OMP but even that requires changes to how the physics work as it changes Earth so it doesn't spin.

There are other sims such as evochron: mercenary that are headed that way but still don't have orbiters physics engine.

Personally, I think that with such a project you are biting off a lot more than you can chew but I wish you the best and look forward to your first working release.

 

[Motherbrain]

The days of endless optimism and being absolutely ignorant of what is possible and what isn't.
Enjoy it while it lasts.

I don't want to get into...a lot...of trouble but I don't think that was
necessary. :dry:
I'm confused what did I do to deserve that???
For one thing IT IS possible and HAS ALREADY BEEN done!!
Some examples...

Orbiter and Spaceway: the physics.
Celestia and Space engine: the stars and the size.
EVE online and Evochron mercenary: the economy.
Will power and determination and a passion for space related games: the actual writing the program.

Why don't you think its possible to make it?
I'm not talking about next gen graphics and big profits.
It would be a hobby just like what Orbiter was when Martin Schweiger started (and no before you ask you don't NEED a PHD in space physics to know how a spaceship flyies to make a game).

I'm sorry but I don't agree with you. I probably shouldn't have forwarded my idea in the first place I was asking for this sort of thing...
And I think WE better drop the subject before I get banned from this place and cant ask for actual help anymore!
Please understand its in my nature to defend my interests and the things I'm interested in...

 

[garyw]

Why don't you think its possible to make it?

how much skill do you have in C++ and Mathematics?

(and no before you ask you don't NEED a PHD in space physics to know how a spaceship flyies to make a game).

You need to understand newtonian physics, the three-body problem and more.

I'm sorry but I don't agree with you.
Please understand its in my nature to defend my interests and the things I'm interested in...

I'd be more interested if you showed up and said 'This is what I've done, now I want to improve it' rather than 'I am going to write the next version of orbiter with interstellar physics and multiplayer', because to date, many others have tried, none have succeeded.

When can we expect an alpha release?

 

[Motherbrain]

Oh gosh I'm not saying "huy guys I'm going to make this awesome space game be back in a couple minutes with it"!
No I'm saying maybe someday when I've gone thru college and know how to write code and know a thing or two about space physics THIS is what I maybe would like to try!
I'm expressing an idea!

These are the things I would like to see in a space game.
No more of this arcade nonsense and no more blasting slimy green aliens to win. No more winning at all!
In short I would like a game like Orbiter that has more then one star, has a small economy and realistic physics and a game that everyone can play for free!
Think of making Orbiter an intergalactic MMO and you have my dream game...

And please just drop it before I (I) get in trouble!

 

[Loru]

With all due respect do you realize shear amount of effort, knowledge, talent and dedication (coding, meshing, texturing, testing) that has to be put in that??

Properly detailed spacecraft may take single pearson a few months to model and texture. Coding unique features of such craft may take another month (animations, internal systems etc.). Now you need accurate physics engine that deals with centimer accuracy at distances of lightyears (even orbiter suffers here - try manual docking around Pluto) & atmospheric flight.

What about economy?? For realistic trade models you need some knowledge about economy too and watching news and reading 2-3 popular books is not enough here.

Sure, you can make some shortcuts like procedural terrain and star systems (or use them in developement process only). You can design common framework for all vessels (SC3 like). You need however know-how, experience and time.

Finally you have to make UI and graphic engine and make sure it runs on various hardware at at least 30 FPS.

Scope of this thing is enormous. Orbiter is 10+ years and is still far from perfection. Without however dedicated community you'd be able to fly 4 spacecrafts not hundreds available to play with ATM.

Yes - it can be done. At this point however I'd recomend few things:
1. Play with orbiter - get to know it, how it works, how it handles models, physics, graphics etc.
2. If you want to create something, start small (simple base, spacecraft3 vessel)
3. Learn as you create smaller things and move into bigger (dll vessel, new common framework for something?)

I'm not trying to discourage you but we've seen here a lot of "great ideas" that went nowewhere simply because proponent didn't realize scope of the thing.

Remember old klingon truth - Rome wasn't built in one day.

 

[Motherbrain]

Thanks Loru. Pure reason VS pure harsh criticism.
I know it would be an enormous undertaking and not something I could just make in a year. Again I'm forwarding an idea.
So far the only actual modifications I've done to Orbiter are customizing some of Steavecasts ships and I have made some simple bases...
Next I would love to learn how to make custom solar systems (although they rarely seem to work on my PC).

 

[Artlav]

Or just play Spaceway to satisfy your desire.
It have a continuous infinite universe, detailed from galaxies and stars in them, down to rocks and trees on the planetary terrains.
All with sub-centimetre accuracy in full Newtonian physics.
All fitting on a single floppy (<1.44Mb).

Should be closer to your "ideal game" than Orbiter is.

 

[Motherbrain]

And I love the program just fine.
Still learning the controls and such...

 

[Face]

Again I'm forwarding an idea.

You see, the idea is nothing new to us. It has been brought forward and discussed to death more than once.

It would need doers - not talkers - to actually bring it to life, so I appreciate your enthusiasm (and promise) that one day you will do it. You just have to excuse my (and many others) doubt that you will ever deliver, because I've seen so many promising proposals that simply went dark after a few weeks of glowing enthusiasm.

No matter how good (or "novel") you think your idea is, rest assured that it will only be done if YOU do it. So as I always did in the past in such situations, I'll do no different thing now: I wish you good luck with your endeavor.

regards,
Face

 

[BruceJohnJennerLawso]

No matter how good (or "novel") you think your idea is, rest assured that it will only be done if YOU do it. So as I always did in the past in such situations, I'll do no different thing now: I wish you good luck with your endeavor.

Yep

Pretty much the deal when it comes to big Orbiter expansions like this. I personally feel that the best way of approaching issues like this is:

A - Check to see if it has already been done. If it has, ask the author (nicely!)

B - If not, go find a good C++ tutorial (say, this? http://www.cplusplus.com/doc/tutorial/)

You will learn an excellent skill in the process, and have pretty much all of the knowledge you need in order to try your idea. And, if the idea isnt doable in Orbiter, you can always create a standalone program for it.