Launch News (Failure) Phobos-Grunt and YingHuo-1 atop Zenit-2 on November 8/9, 2011

[Urwumpe]

That video is not 27 MB large, as I initially thought, it is only 272 MB large...luckily I decided to shove it directly on my external HDD.

 

[SiberianTiger]

From here.
I think it's a good news. Hope is not dead yet

Calm down, it's a damned Chinese flying lantern.

 

[Scrooge McDuck]

That video is not 27 MB large, as I initially thought, it is only 272 MB large...luckily I decided to shove it directly on my external HDD.

Yes, and the server is a bit slow. Still downloading here...
I hope this spacecraft can be saved!

 

[Urwumpe]

Yes, and the server is a bit slow. Still downloading here...
I hope this spacecraft can be saved!

I doubt that the video will show much, since the visual conditions in Brazil at this time would have been pretty poor, but before I reject it, I better check it.

 

[Dive]

I watched the whole video, i can see a flyby of a satelite. I cant say that it's exactly Phobos-Grunt, i think it may be ISS. However, this video was posted on official website of the project, so i believe it is PG.

 

[Urwumpe]

I watched the whole video, i can see a flyby of a satelite. I cant say that it's exactly Phobos-Grunt, i think it may be ISS. However, this video was posted on official website of the project, so i believe it is PG.

No. There are some faint structures at the bottom edge of it, that help tellings its size, motion and luminosity, that one isn't a satellite. Also the time does not fit: it would be late morning there, not dark night.

This is a fake, sadly.

A GPS satellite that used a solid upper stage for deployment would have been easily visible from the ground, but Phobos-Grunt uses liquid propellants with nearly no visible flame when active.

 

[N_Molson]

I will follow what I think is the general advice and say this mission was a little over-ambitious, given that it was delayed by 15 years. Also, the addition of a secondary payload at the last minute was, I think, an engineering heresy. It gave me the impression of a "jury-rigged" Mars train, also considering that it was a first flight for the upgraded Fregat stage. :shrug:

I'd say let's focus on the forecoming SoyuzTMA mission, automatic probes are one thing, manned missions are another.

Also, we can consider that the launch itself was a success, which makes the end of 2011 a welcome serie of successful consecutive rocket launches.

 

[Cosmic Penguin]

My goodness, this is not sounding good at all.....

Quote from Sab on the NK forums:

основная проблема состоит в том, что малонаправленные антенны МНА сейчас затенены сбрасываемым баком и управляющий сигнал для перезагрузки систем не проходит. Никто не предпологал, что придется работать в такой ситуации. Остронаправленная антенна ОНА сейчас в зачекованном положении. Для тех кто тут нес чушь про системы связи, все что установлено на АМС - самое надежное из того что есть, самое дубовое и безотказное. ТМИ нет, не потому что мы не можем ее получить, а потому что аппарат ее не выдает (по какой то причине), и сама по себе она не появится. Поздно вечером снова будут попытки передать управляющий сигнал. На этом все до завтрашнего рабочего дня. ПС старайтесь хотя бы не обижать тех людей, которые с вами инфой деляться. И не ведитесь на теории заговора. Нет в сми новой инфы, только из-за того что ее действительно НЕТ. И ни кто не хочет лишний раз светить свою фамилию сообщая неблагоприятные вести...

A rough translation by Vladi:

The latest rumour on NK has it that the low-gain omnidirectional antenna is not visible from the ground stations as the first fuel tank (the one that was supposed to be disposed of after the first burn) covers it. Which in turn means that they cannot reset the spacecraft and send orders (the directional antennas have really small field of view so chances of a signal being in the way are non-existent). If that is the case, is there any chance that they could get lucky and get a shot at the directional receivers or perhaps put enough power so that the craft could detect the input on the low-gain antenna?

And the latest official news report that confirms the failure of contacting the spacecraft by ESA's ground stations:

ESA stations failed to contact the "Phobos-Grunt"

MOSCOW, November 10 - RIA Novosti. Stations of the European Space Agency (ESA), located in Australia and Kourou, French Guiana, was unable to establish contact with the Russian interplanetary station "Phobos-Grunt", three more attempts will be made by European experts in the night from Thursday to Friday, RIA Novosti Head of the ESA in Russia Rene Pishel.

"Our stations have tried to communicate with the device" Phobos-Grunt "today, but they did not succeed. We will try again. Our station at night again try to contact with" Phobos-Grunt "to telemetry data from the device," - said Pishel.

According to him, apart from the ESA stations in Australia and Kourou, to establish a connection with the "Phobos-Grunt" will help them to another station of ESA, located on the island of Gran Canaria (one of the Canary Islands, Spain).

Pishel noted that the ESA is in regular contact with their Russian colleagues, including experts from the Lavochkin, which manufactured the device.

Earlier, the head of the ESA in the Russian Federation reported that information from the station "Phobos-Grunt" can only be for six to nine minutes as the spacecraft is in low orbit.

 

[Artlav]

The latest rumour on NK has it that the low-gain omnidirectional antenna is not visible from the ground stations as the first fuel tank (the one that was supposed to be disposed of after the first burn) covers it. Which in turn means that they cannot reset the spacecraft and send orders

Bad design...

Any way to reach that from other sides?
There should be all kinds of comm satellites flying around, maybe some or other can send the signal from the proper angle?

As a last resort, can they send up a powerful transmitter in a warhead of an ASAT missile or something like that?

 

[Codz]

Just the thought of a mission with such potential simpely burning up is almost sickening.

 

[Urwumpe]

Just the thought of a mission with such potential simpely burning up is almost sickening.

That is spaceflight. Sometimes you eat the bear, sometimes you are eaten by the bear.

 

[boogabooga]

Bad design...
As a last resort, can they send up a powerful transmitter in a warhead of an ASAT missile or something like that?

Or is someone going to use an ASAT to simply bring it down. 13 metric tones with 7 metric tones of hypergolic fuel should make for quite a light show. But better to set it off in space than on the way to the ground.

It is sad though. :facepalm:

 

[Urwumpe]

Or is someone going to use an ASAT to simply bring it down. 13 metric tones with 7 metric tones of hypergolic fuel should make for quite a light show. But better to set it off in space than on the way to the ground.

With full fuel tanks, it wouldn't get even close to the ground during reentry. It is no space telescope.

(As addendum: I also dislike the use of ASATs for removing space debris, because it causes more of it - a single satellite has a smaller risk footprint as many debris parts)

 

[Codz]

That is spaceflight. Sometimes you eat the bear, sometimes you are eaten by the bear.

I know, but still it sucks to see such a promising mission in the garbage.

 

[N_Molson]

I also dislike the use of ASATs for removing space debris

And imagine the missile itself has a glitch and locks the wrong target, a fully operating foreign satellite, that would be a disaster... LEO is pretty crowded. :shifty:

 

[IronRain]

And imagine the missile itself has a glitch and locks the wrong target, a fully operating foreign satellite, that would be a disaster... LEO is pretty crowded. :shifty:

ISS...

 

[Urwumpe]

And imagine the missile itself has a glitch and locks the wrong target, a fully operating foreign satellite, that would be a disaster... LEO is pretty crowded. :shifty:

Not that crowded yet. :lol:

 

[Hartmann]

If could be possible use another satellite as a data relay system .

 

[orb]

The Planetary Society Blog: Phobos-Grunt status, two days after launch

Parabolic Arc: Hope for Phobos-Grunt Fading

SPACE.com: Russia Races to Save Mars Moon Probe from Space Junk Fate

Discovery News: Time Running Short for Stranded Mars Probe

 

[GigaG]

This will be the biggest satellite to crash this year if the engineers can't get the engine running. Hopefully they will get it to work.